sphinxeyes
gardener
Suburbia, small garden in side yard, containers on larger back deck. Hot humid summers.
Posts: 154
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Post by sphinxeyes on Jul 31, 2009 21:23:54 GMT -5
I'm growing alpine strawberries in 3 gallon buckets with holes drilled in the sides for drainage. I started them from seed in March in the greenhouse, then moved them outside when the weather warmed up. The tops of the buckets are lush with leaves and although a few have rotted or dried out, new growth continues to replace it. But now it's nearly August and they haven't done anything else. No flowers, no sign of fruit. Am I doing something wrong here? Is it too warm or too cold? The temps have been quite varied this year. Or do these strawberries just take a long time to bear fruit?
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Post by silverseeds on Jul 31, 2009 22:46:18 GMT -5
You wont have fruit the first year. If you get any blossoms, pinch them off. I know you might want that one berry or two, but if they come, pinch them off. It takes the plant alot of energy the first year to produce, one or two berries, if it tries to, they wont always. they take low temps just fine, from now on, bu this first year, they need that extra energy, that would have been wasted making one or two berries. This way they have a better root system then produce WAY better the next year. next spring you should get a good harvest. I dont know much about that particular strawberry, but we grew 20 or 30 acres of them at the farm I used to work at. We would pinch off the blossoms of whole feilds, the ones we grew would produce well the first year, better the second, and 3rd and 4th equaled the 2nd, it apparently went downhill from there, and wed start new ones in another field, which wouldnt produce the fist year. I hope that helps.
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sphinxeyes
gardener
Suburbia, small garden in side yard, containers on larger back deck. Hot humid summers.
Posts: 154
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Post by sphinxeyes on Jul 31, 2009 22:59:50 GMT -5
Ah, that would explain it. Since I have them growing in buckets, should I keep them outdoors and let them die back? Or do I need to bring them indoors to overwinter?
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Post by silverseeds on Aug 1, 2009 1:22:34 GMT -5
well, different types could be different, but ours never died back in winter. it was hardy. Still green in the snow....
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Post by Alan on Aug 1, 2009 14:28:50 GMT -5
No need to pinch off the alpines, they are heavy producers and will be just fine.
They don't like high temperatures and full/hot sun all the time. put them somewhere shaded, prune them back one good time, give just a bit of nitrogen and quite a bit of phosphorus, this fall you should have one heck of a harvest.
This is how I treat mine this time of the year, if you can get them moved before high temps set in they will react much better and be more productive, if not the option I mentioned above works best.
You can leave them outside in winter, but don't leave them in buckets, if the root zone freezes they will perish, put them in the ground and mulch well with straw or bring them in. If you bring them in and give them some sun they will make flowers which you can either brush over several times with your hand or use and electric toothbrush to cause to produce all winter long.
Hope this helps!
-Alan
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Post by PatrickW on Aug 1, 2009 14:59:07 GMT -5
Alan, So far I've had a great harvest from the white alpines you sent me, wow! They are really great. They are huge, and taste great. All this, and it's still the first year. I'm starting to think about doing some selections, do you have any advice? Do you select for taste, size, both or something else?
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Post by Alan on Aug 1, 2009 15:14:56 GMT -5
Glad you enjoy them Patrick!
Definitely attempt some selection work on them. I go for size, taste, productivity, keeping quality, and winter hardiness, it's working out well. I just planted out 600 plants in a small plot the other day and they are taking off quickly. I was also able to aquire some 60 new varieties of alpines, some chiloneese, and some musk types as well which I will try to offer next season, they were all slow to germinate and are slow to grow but should be worth it.
BTW, keep up the great work on the blog and seed saving network and the SSE themed posts, I would be posting here and on the blog more if I just had time
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Post by Alan on Aug 1, 2009 15:17:18 GMT -5
Forgot to mention, if you have a food dehydrator I use it to dry them down for seed, you can rub them between your hands over a plate and the seed will fall off freely, the leftover strawberries make a terrific potpouri and don't taste half bad dried down either, throw them in a bowl of oatmeal or qinoa cooked like oatmeal and they are terrific.
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Post by silverseeds on Aug 1, 2009 22:34:20 GMT -5
lol well I didnt try to mislead you. I guess we had a different type of strawberry, and I didnt even think of it being in a bucket so its above the frost line. The type we grew WAS very productive though.
He grew the same variety since 68 when he started.
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Post by PatrickW on Aug 2, 2009 3:33:35 GMT -5
That's a great idea Alan. I've been meaning to try them in the dehydrator, because we get dehydrated strawberries at the local market, so I knew it's possible. Right now I don't have enough plants giving enough harvest to make it worth running the dehydrator, but it's on my list!
I put rhubarb in the the dehydrator this year to make leather, and I was thinking strawberry-rhubarb leather is probably pretty nice...
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Post by mnjrutherford on Aug 2, 2009 7:18:04 GMT -5
Where can you get phosphorus? I've been trying to source it but I'm told that I can get it only in a commercial fertilizer mix.
Dehydrator... I'm using a small fan and cake cooling racks. The fan keeps the room cool and drys things simultaneously. I've got cuke and tomato seeds drying at the moment. I'll be starting up tomatoes a little later today.
Strawberries would be wonderful with all sorts of things including fruit cakes, minced and mixed with some toasted pecans as a topping for ice cream or perhaps yogurt, stewed into a compote with other fruits, cooked into a syrup for Christmas pancakes, as a flavor quirk in a pork sausage... Strawberries.... ummmm... =o)
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Post by PatrickW on Aug 2, 2009 7:45:53 GMT -5
Jo, did your soil test indicate you were short on phosphorus? I don't remember that. Phosphorus is a natural mineral.
Anyway, there are two ways I know to add phosphorus to the soil, the first is with commercial fertilizer, and this is called 'super phosphate'. I think the one that's popular now is called 'triple super phosphate'. These are made by mixing the natural mineral with acid (sulphuric acid or phosphoric acid), and they are immediately available to your plants. Unfortunately these are also toxic, and in particular will tie up other micro-nutrients in the ground meaning your plants will develop other deficiencies, and are not in any way organic. Once you get super phosphate in your ground it stays a long time, and it's very difficult to get rid of. It doesn't wash away with rain, because it chemically binds with the soil. Most chemical fertilizers contain this kind of phosphate.
Then there is the organic way. Phosphorus is a naturally occurring mineral, and it can be purchased. It's called rock phosphate, and can simply be added to your garden, sprinkled around. The disadvantage of doing it this way? It is not available to your plants in it's natural state, and won't become available for at least three years after you add it to your garden. This is why farmers don't use rock phosphate, because if they need phosphorus in their ground, they don't want to wait so long.
Alan, how do you get phosphorus into your garden?
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Post by grunt on Aug 2, 2009 14:05:56 GMT -5
Jo: Chances are, since the previous owners were a commercial enterprise, that there is ample if not excessive phosphorus in your soil, but not in a form accessible by your plants. If I am remembering correctly, this thread should give you information on how to help free it up alanbishop.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=banter&action=display&thread=2579. I just don't remember which of the vrious concoctions would be the right one.
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Post by stevil on Aug 2, 2009 14:19:43 GMT -5
Had the weekend free from the garden and took part in a botanical survey of our kommune all weekend . A few interesting edibles turned up including this wild strawberry Fragaria vesca with very long fruits growing in a very small area (a piece followed me home): The cloudberry season is almost over in our area, but we did find enough for a snack: I've never dried strawberries as I've never had a surplus, but dry more or less everything else: Apples, bilberries, cherries, serviceberries, plums, raspberries etc. The drying process enhances and sweetens the taste of most berries. Never make jam/jelly any more and no need for a freezer. Blackcurrants take a long time to dry and I'm not sure I'd bother with gooseberries.
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Post by Alan on Aug 2, 2009 14:58:56 GMT -5
That's a nice vesca! Once you get it going could I bother you for a sample.
The cloudberry is beautiful! Hows the taste? Worth cultivating?
As far as phosphorus, as long as land isn't completely degraded and according to the Illinois system of permanent fertility there should be close to 2,000 lbs of naturally occuring Phosphorus per acre. For pots my worm castings have worked well, I'm not sure how I get the numbers I do but the castings that I've been having tested have been anywhere from 0.5-1-1 all the way up to 3-3-3 strangely enough.
However If I really need Phosphorus Rock Guano when available and harvested responsibly has worked well and provides quite a bit of immediately available/soluable phosphorus, particularly when ground, bone meal has worked well for us too, the finer the ground the better.
Hope that helps.
-Alan
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