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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 25, 2019 21:42:40 GMT -5
So I haven't updated this thread much this year because my own crop did not do the best. But that does not mean this project is dead. I tried to select and plant the seeds this year only from the ones with traits that seemed desirable (especially for eating). I think I planted about 10-12 "strains". I'll try to come back and edit this post with the names if i haven't already posted. But anyway, yeah, so my plans mostly failed as most of them failed to thrive at all. My corn crop did fantastic which was planted as an afterthought rather than the main project ironically. But as it turns out the strongest "strain" continued to grow and set fruit regardless of the poor conditions. A testament to good genetics I would think. I still have plenty of backup seed from the large population from last year, so even if I had a complete crop failure I would have been fine. A good reason to only plant 50% of your seed! But I've heard this project in Germany and Australia? Might be doing well this season. So in other ways by sharing my seed far and wide ive hedged my bets. Hopefully they will post pictures and updates soon too. More members are joining the project on the Experimental Farm Network. -Andrew
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 22, 2019 14:46:47 GMT -5
Finally grew Big Hill for the first time this year. Since I planted tomatoes late I got my fist ripe tomato this year. Taste was great . I will be adding this variety to my must grow list from now on. This one is a keeper. Did well for me this year. Very productive.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 10, 2019 13:31:21 GMT -5
Pure Chilense never set fruit for me either. Wonder if I should have tried hand pollination.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 7, 2019 21:32:02 GMT -5
The zea hybrids that I shared with Joseph from the usda that he shared with Reed are descended from diploperennis.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 7, 2019 9:53:26 GMT -5
I am looking for seeds from the wild of sunflowers Helianthus annus Ipomoea pandurata, Passiflora incarnata and lutea, any perennial native Hibiscus like palustris, laevis, coccineus and so on Thanks for your help! Is there a particular reason? There are lots of wild sunflowers around here with multiple seedheads, small seedheads, and small seeds. They are usually fairly drought tolerant and abundant, but the small birds love their seeds. I might be able to try and collect some. Also Malva neglecta is a common weed here. In the mallow / cotton / hibiscus family.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 6, 2019 19:35:09 GMT -5
Yes Andrew, I think you are the one who found the paper. I can’t find it either. Will update when I have progress. Found it! reed! I have an idea! Apparently you only need to cover one leaf on each plant to get them to flower early! I think this would work on non-day-neutral teosinte! www.google.com/podcasts?feed=aHR0cDovL2l0dW5lc2NvbnRlbnQudWNkYXZpcy5lZHUvbWVkaWEvMjAwOS9XSS9QTEIxMTIvMTAwLnJzcw&episode=aHR0cDovL2l0dW5lc2NvbnRlbnQudWNkYXZpcy5lZHUvbWVkaWEvMjAwOS9XSS9QTEIxMTIvUExCMTEyLTFfMjAwOS0wMy0wNS5tcDMThis course, taught by UC Davis plant biology professor John Harada, focuses on the mechanisms and control processes that underlie plant growth, development and response to the environment, with primary attention devoted to flowering plants. Topics are selected to emphasize developmental concepts applicable to several aspects of plant growth and development. Material is presented by discussing experiments employing the approaches of morphology, physiology, genetics, and cell and molecular biology that were used to discover the biological information. (The course is targeted to upper division undergraduate students who have taken an introductory biology course and a genetics course. The audience is primarily general biology majors who do not specialize on plants.) "Podcast" plant growth and development winter 2009, episode #4, transition to flowering.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Sept 6, 2019 7:24:15 GMT -5
Bumping an old thread here... I did read somewhere (I think?) that covering (I guess the same) couple of leaves instead of the whole plant may work. Reviewing the function of Florigen that inhibits the reproductive stage in short day plants, it seems to make sense that if some of the plant produces the hormone for reproductive development it may be enough to trigger flowering. I have Zea diploperennis flowering as of today. Only silks, but flowering 75 odd days after planting in a growth room. Tried to pollinate using Hopi blue, but will try the reciprocal cross when teosinte pollen comes online. Interesting that diploperennis is naturalised in a few sites in Queensland, Australia - from what I can gather introduced/trialed many years ago as a tropical cattle forage. Yes, I think I'm the one who found a paper that said that and shared it here. I wouldn't know if I could find it again, but yeah. I forgot about it though Haha. Cool! Let us know how it goes. I'm still interested in this.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Aug 18, 2019 13:51:35 GMT -5
You can have perfectly good snows and snaps with a homozygous recessive complement of either parchment type. In fact the Sugar Snap varieties I tested via staining and test crosses were all low parchment with only one recessive homozygous set. Hope that helps. Steve, can you create a pdf with pictures of a good guide on how we can do our own staining to figure out if our pods are P or V or both? -Andrew
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Aug 10, 2019 23:13:53 GMT -5
I haven't tried Shiraz – It doesn't look to me like a truly fibreless variety. It isn`t a true mangetout variety. I was quite disappointed when I grew it. You can eat it when really young but there are better varieties. Yes. With some luck I got someone from the UK to send me some and I also was very disappointed. Very fibery. Honestly I think golden sweet tasted better than shiraz. The best purple snow pea I have is Midnight Snow and was bred by Dan Quickert of the old website purplepeas.net (waybackmachine still has it). It actually is a very nice snow pea with little fiber. I've been meaning to use it in some crosses but I have not yet. I grew out some seed to share this year. I think I'm gonna grow it more often. flic.kr/p/2gizoTkflic.kr/p/2giyPk7Red pod. flic.kr/p/2giySPwYellow pod that I thought had the orange-pod gene. Not the yellow extending effect I was hoping for though. Hard to tell in the photo. I need a better camera that doesn't wash out color. Another one. flic.kr/p/2gizp6Qflic.kr/p/2gizpgQflic.kr/p/2giySDbAnd 2 of Midnight Snow. flic.kr/p/2giz53qflic.kr/p/2gUuQPs(P.s. Rebsie, you might want to check out the new open source plant breeding forum OSSI).
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jul 22, 2019 23:41:42 GMT -5
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jun 20, 2019 13:29:45 GMT -5
So are you guys trying congruity backcrossing with your interspecies hybrids? With the self incompatability genes, you'd need another compatible line - but crossing back to each parent in turn over 4 generations might sort your infertility issue (if its pollen related). It was the recommended strategy for pollen infertility issues in tepary x vulgaris beans. And another random thought, maybe germinate the pollen on a compatible stigma for a period (4-24 hrs), then use that stigma to pollinate the F1, F2... Germinated pollen bypasses stigmatic incompatability. Might cut down the numbers game. I'd be interested to see how it goes... Cheers Steve That's a very interesting idea! I might have to try that. I have 1 pennellii hybrid f3 generation. This year might be a wash in terms of other tomato crosses. Just too much going on this year, but hopefully I can put in some raises beds at the new house we are renting. Apparently I have to go through an architecture committee first. HOAs are terrible.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jun 18, 2019 10:42:19 GMT -5
Thanks, Andrew, for your ideas! I should definitely try combining orp x gp x antocyanin genes and B gene modifier...
Please, can you clarify me one thing? Is there any difference between ppVV and VVpp? I think there is not, but may be I am wrong as I have no background i genetics. Now, if there is no difference you always get ppVV from that cross, which is the pod with partial parchment not different from its parents. But what I can see is qualitative difference between many parchmented pods in the F2 cross of Goldens Sweet x Shiraz and pods without substantial parchment in both parents.
It is also very interesting that cross between Shiraz and other two snow pea varieties (Oregon Sugar Pod and Sweet Horizon) have not produced any parchmented pods in F2 generation. So the problem probably is in Golden Sweet. And there might be also some other genes responsible for pod parchment apart from P and V:
"In addition to the major genes, we have observed quantitative differences in pod fiber that probably are the result of uncharacterized minor genes." (In: Plant Breeding Reviews, Volume 21.) There might be other minor fiber genetics, but I would need to look at the JIC PGENE database to find out. Their website has changed recently, but they are a very good resource. data.jic.ac.uk/pgene/Default.asp?ID=340According to a pea breeding video on YouTube about snap peas there is some difference between ppVV and PPvv. Here is the photo from that slide. openwetware.org/wiki/Pea_Database_Collaboration_Project/Pea_GeneticsBased on my own palate I did not like Shiraz as it seemed like some sort of fiber was still present to me. Same with Golden Sweet. Not sure which Genes in each. Though I do remember seeing the constricted pod gene in golden sweet.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jun 17, 2019 7:11:51 GMT -5
Hello folks, I am new to this forum. I live in the heart of Europe in Czech Republic not so far away from Brno where Mendel experimented with hybridizing peas:-) I would like to add my first little experience with searching for red podded pea and ask you few questions at the same time. I have crossed Golden Sweet and Shiraz two years ago. This year I have sown around 1000 F2 seeds. I have two observations: 1) I got 86 partly or almost fully red podded plants in the F2 generation. The problem is truly red coloured are only very young pods on each plant, as the older and more matured pods always turn purple. I think the reason behind is colouring of Golden Sweet pods. Because truly yellow pods of this variety are only the young pods while the older pods seem to be more green than yellow. So as yellow turns green in the cross between Golden Sweet and Shiraz the resulting colour affected by anthocyanins turns from red to purple. I think the solution might be to replace the Golden Sweet with another yellow podded variety with more stable yellow in its pods. Is there any such a variety? Or is my line of Golden Sweet just not enough yellow? 2) I expected all the pods in the cross will be without parchment as both parents Shiraz and Golden Sweet are snow peas and crossing ppvv x ppvv should always give ppvv, shouldn´t it? So I was surprised to find out many pods in the F2 generation have the parchment inside the pods. Do you have any idea how is it possible?
The video below shows 86 red-podded plants selected from about 1000 plants in the F2 generation cross between Shiraz and Golden Sweet.
Good job on your crosses! And welcome! Many of us here also participate on the Open Source Seed Initiative forum as well, but there is more info here. In my experience and opinion I don't believe Shiraz OR Golden Sweet are very good snow peas. And by that i mean that no, i do not think either variety is ppvv. The only varieties I taste that might be ppvv are Carouby de Maussaunne, Bijou, Green Beauty, and Dwarf Gray Sugar. And various green snap peas. If my assumptions are true then really that cross is ppVV X VVpp and you are getting a wide range of fiber segregation. The yellow pod mutation does indeed get washed out and light colored over time. There is no other form of it, but some people may be able to select superior selections of it. There are two possible solutions to this. 1. Try using the B gene modifier to have pink flowers and lighter anthocyanins. Someone in England has some varieties like this already. Or 2. Try using the orange-pod gene (orp) in combination with the yellow-pod gene (gp). I am investigating this idea. Orange starts out green and becomes brighter orange the longer it grows and matures. The problem is orp might or might not be tied to certain fiber Gene's. If true, a really good red pod might only be possible in a shelling pea. But until we try we won't know. I am growing some F2s of this cross this season.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jun 16, 2019 22:02:28 GMT -5
I am very interested in cuttings of Salmonberry, Tayberry, Boysenberries, and others. On a bit of a berry adventure right now. Oh and HoneyBerry. I guess they are blueberry-like in the honey suckle family. If anyone has any available let me know. I'm willing to pay
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on May 27, 2019 9:09:52 GMT -5
Red-seeded watermelons are pretty rare, though, aside from citrons, as far as I'm aware. Yeah, I think I've run across 4 or 5 at most. But red seeded watermelon seeds seem to be popular in china, so it's possible there are way more.
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