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Post by toad on May 21, 2011 16:28:09 GMT -5
Inspired by the corn breeding and heat unit thread, I've counted my heat units for my melon breeding last year.
The result is 1197 CDD:50F
I guess it is quite good, but I don't know. Has anybody else counted the heat units after melon growing?
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on May 21, 2011 21:07:04 GMT -5
My earliest muskmelon/cantaloupe fruit harvested last summer was at ~820 GDD10C (1480 GDD50F).
My main harvest occurred due to a killing frost at ~950 GDD10C (1710 GDD50F)
My first Blacktail Mountain watermelon last year required
874 GDD10C (1573 GDD50F). Charleston Gray watermelon was around 1044 GDD10C (188050F).
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Post by toad on May 23, 2011 14:46:41 GMT -5
Thanks Joseph. I gives me a good perspective for my melon breeding.
183 GDD:50F had already passed, before I could sow my melons, and the total last year was 1586 GDD:50F.
First frost came in first half of october at 1577 GDD:50F. The melon plants seems to die from mildew every year in late september, at 1501 GDD:50F. That means the possible growing period for melon last year summed up to 1318 GDD:50F
Fortunately last summer was on the cold side, I hope for ekstra GDD:50F this year :-)
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Post by raymondo on May 24, 2011 7:12:27 GMT -5
Is 10C (50F) a good base for melons? Seems reasonable.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on May 24, 2011 13:07:53 GMT -5
Is 10C (50F) a good base for melons? Seems reasonable. I'm certainly not the expert, but it seems a little low to me. I'm not sure what temperatures cantaloupe or honeydew melons grow well at, but from what i've read watermelon need at least 60F (~15.5C). So i would think a base of 60F would be more realistic. from the weather underground site using the "custom" weather option it say's for 2009 the 50F(10C) GDD was 2242 from April 1 - Oct 1. Using the GDD calculator it say's i had about 2391 GDD in 2009 50F(10C) from April 1 - Oct 1st. But using the calculator it say's i had about 984.5 GDD at a base of 60F(~15.5C) from April 1st - Oct 1st 2009. That's certainly a bit low, but in some ways i think it's more accurate. Perhaps a bit on the pessimistic side, but oh well. www.weather.com/outdoors/agriculture/growing-degree-days/ |
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Post by toad on May 25, 2011 12:32:30 GMT -5
If I go for the same 60F (~15.5C) base, I get the following counted from April 1 - Oct 1. : last year 2010 = 417.0 GDD and the year before: 2009 = 489.0 GDD
Probably a good baseline for watermelons, but I get a feeling it's a bit high for melon (Cucumis melo). On the other hand, 10C(50F) might be a bit low.
What would be the reasonable way to calculate the best baseline?
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on May 25, 2011 19:04:52 GMT -5
If I go for the same 60F (~15.5C) base, I get the following counted from April 1 - Oct 1. : last year 2010 = 417.0 GDD and the year before: 2009 = 489.0 GDD Probably a good baseline for watermelons, but I get a feeling it's a bit high for melon (Cucumis melo). On the other hand, 10C(50F) might be a bit low. What would be the reasonable way to calculate the best baseline? It could be done by measuring the melons growth each day (the difference from the day before), and graphing that against the GDD for that day. Eventually with enough measurements it would be clear from the graph at which GDD the plant starts growing. |
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Post by 12540dumont on May 25, 2011 19:34:51 GMT -5
I checked the "Knott's Handbook"
Cukes and Melons are rated as
Minimum to grow:60 degrees
Optimum: 65-75
Maximum: 90
Remember this is a general guideline for all melons and cukes, and there may be some that do well outside this range.
Last year when it hit 100 here, the melons sunburned and died. I guess nothing likes it that hot.
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Post by toad on May 29, 2011 14:23:32 GMT -5
It could be done by measuring the melons growth each day (the difference from the day before), and graphing that against the GDD for that day. Eventually with enough measurements it would be clear from the graph at which GDD the plant starts growing. Thanks Joseph. Very logical solution, although demanding a lot of observation. But I guess it could speed up my breeding, if I evaluate the GDD individually, plant by plant. I will sow next week-end, if the weather warms up. I guess I should take a daily photo including a ruler. Then I can sit down from time to time, to do the analysis. |
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Post by toad on May 29, 2011 14:41:16 GMT -5
Dumont, I my melon growing habit with the 60F GDD, and they seem to match. 90 F is a rare temperature here, not likely to cause any problems :-)
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Jun 25, 2011 2:40:59 GMT -5
Thanks Joseph. Very logical solution, although demanding a lot of observation. But I guess it could speed up my breeding, if I evaluate the GDD individually, plant by plant. I am doing that intentionally with corn: Planting seeds into soil that is way too cold, and where there is a huge risk of frost damage. If I plant 10,000 corn seeds for the trial, I'll only allow the earliest/hardiest 0.5% to produce seed. I'm not measuring GDD directly, but I am selecting those plants that grow better at lower temperatures than their peers do. I am doing that inadvertently with muskmelons... By planting into soil that is too cold, and culling out slow growing plants. In my short cold-nighted season, a plant has to germinate in coldish weather, and thrive immediately or there is no sense even growing it. My biggest problem with watermelons is that they take a very long time to germinate after my last frost date, and the weeds overwhelm the patch before the watermelons come up... I was calculating today that if I pre-germinated them at 95 degrees F for a few days that might translate to 3 weeks earlier harvest. Transplants have never worked well for me because they are set back so much by the transplant shock. My cumulative GDD this year is 3 weeks behind 2008 and 2009, and 2 weeks behind 2010. Maybe not a good year to be attempting a watermelon breeding program. Although anything that produces fruit aught to be very early. |
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jun 25, 2011 12:08:27 GMT -5
My biggest problem with watermelons is that they take a very long time to germinate after my last frost date, and the weeds overwhelm the patch before the watermelons come up... most of my watermelons germinated fairly early after i planted them, but I know what you mean about the weeds. Weeding when they were just emerging was a pain in the butt (and the legs). They are finally getting to a decent size where i can tell them easily apart from the weeds, but truthfully i wish they were growing faster. Yeah, you are probably right about this being a bad year for watermelons, but if anything survives to mature fruit this year, it's almost certain to be a good early one. At least that is my hope also. |
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Jun 29, 2011 12:32:18 GMT -5
Has anyone ever grown or eaten a Christmas Melon (Piel de Sapo) before?
I just had my first one last week. It was probably close to the best melon i have ever eaten. I think i might even like them better than watermelon. Apparently it is the most popular melon in spain, but not very common here in the U.S. I saved the seeds and intend to plant them next year. I searched and found out that they can be grown in California, Arizona, and even here in Colorado. I also found a site where a guy in Vermont had great success with them.
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Post by jonnyyuma on Jun 29, 2011 12:48:22 GMT -5
Hello, You can search out some research done by the University of Arizona by Dr. Silvertooth for optimum heat units for melon (muskmelon-western shipper type). I have attached a link below. I believe he used 55/85 f. ag.arizona.edu/crops/presentations/2003/silvertooth060403.pdfYou can select for cold emergence and cold vigor in watermelon, it is genetically controlled, though it is quite complex. Thanks Jonny |
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Post by ottawagardener on Jun 29, 2011 13:34:01 GMT -5
Extreme Gardener (site member), also in Vermont, is a big fan too (perhaps the same person?). Anyhow, I am growing a selection of melon this year, including hopefully Piel de Sapo - I'll have to check to see how it's doing. My husband is from Spain which was my part of my initial interest.
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