Cherry Trees from mature tree root systems

[seedywen]

Every year, a few cherry trees grow in my perennial flower beds off the root system of my excellent Queen Anne Cherry, about 15-20 feet away.

Have always cut them off or tried to dig them out, because of not wanting trees that will grow large in those flower beds. Without success, mind you as every year, a couple more small trees grow again in or near the same spot.

Question: If these small trees were left to grow, are they going to be the same as the parent tree, or inferior fruiting trees?

If the same, I might start letting the trees grow and just go over to shade-loving perennials underneath.

[mjc]

That really depends...

If they are dwarf or semi-dwarf Queen Annes, then definitiely no. They would be whatever the rootstock variety is (or even possibly a wild plum). If they are 'standard' trees, on their own roots, then yes, they'd be clones of the parent tree.

As to whether or not the fruit would be 'good'...that really depends on what that rootstock is. Mazzard and Mahaleb are two commonly used sweet cherry rootstocks...they both have 'usable' fruit in their own right, but neither has 'large' cherries. They are also used for different purposes than something like a Queen Anne.

The chances of them being rootstock varieties are pretty high, because most domesticated fruits don't have the propensity to sucker like that, while many rootstock varieties do (often because many of the rootstocks ARE really just wild/species/'unimproved' varieties of the fruit in question).

[grunt]

You can find out whether they will be something you want, without letting them grow up in your garden = but it will take a year or two. Let one sprout develop to the appropriate size for grafting, and graft it on the main tree = in a year or two you will get fruit on it that will tell you whether it is worth doing. I don't have the patience for that any more, but it is doable.

[steev]

Alternatively, you could dig and pot up some of these suckers to use as rootstocks for grafting something you want.

[mnjrutherford]

I like Steev's idea a lot, particularly here. Acquiring appropriate root stock is not easy peasy I discovered last year. I've got some hazels that are suckering like crazy and I've been wondering about doing something with those suckers. How would I know if they are RS or not? I would plant them along the treeline down to the creek as part of our forest food supply. Still need to get a different breed to go with them for pollination though.

[coppice]

May 25, 2011 7:01:22 GMT -5 mnjrutherford said:

Still need to get a different breed to go with them for pollination though.

Um no you'll need more than one. Not others of different cultivar.

[mnjrutherford]

What do you mean? Am I using the wrong descriptors? As I understand, for nuts, (I've read mostly about pecans and hazels in particular) they release and receive pollen at the different times. If you have 5 Atrees, they will release pollen in February and receive pollen in March. Therefore, they can not pollinate themselves. You will need Btrees, which release pollen in March and receive pollen in April. That will allow the Atrees to produce nuts. If you get Ctrees, which receive pollen in February and release pollen in April, you will get nuts from all 3 types.

This is what I've read. I don't have first hand knowledge. Well, not a lot. We have 3 hazels, all the same kind, and they are planted 10' apart. They produce flowers and the pollen thingies but there are no nuts. That's the sum total of my so called "expertise". I know a lot more about making pancakes. ;o)

[steev]

A rootstock is whatever you graft onto, although most "official" rootstocks are valued for particular traits: dwarfing; semi-dwarfing; particular disease resistance; tolerance of soggy ground; etc. Often it isn't the same species as the graft; quince is often used as a rootstock for European pears, for instance.

So you might plant out a number of your hazel suckers and eventually graft desireable hazel varieties onto them. I've planted a few black walnut seedlings for this reason. I don't need the nuts, really, since trees are all over and the nuts are free for the gathering, but because I can eventually graft English walnuts of various varieties onto these established rootstocks. I think they would also serve for pecans and such.

[mjc]

Black walnut is used for butternut, English/Carpatian walnut, heart nut and a couple of others...not pecans.

Pecans, if grafted, go onto seedling pecans OR a hickory.

Hazels are usually grafted to wild seedling stock. It helps prevent certain diseases that are endemic here and not in Europe.

Quince is a good all around rootstock for pomes...apples, medlar, pear, crabapples. Although, it has to be the 'true' quince and not it's relative the Japanese (flowering) quince. For apples and crabs, though, more often than not another apple or a crab is used, sometimes hawthorn.

Wild plum can be used for just about any stone fruit.

Cross genus rootstocks usually result in dwarfing the grafted item (can be extreme). Cross species (like domestic apples on crabapple rootstock) can also be dwarfed, but usually not as much...think semi-dwarf.

[steev]

So pecans on black walnut wouldn't work, or isn't done? I ask because gophers don't seem to bother black walnuts, a real plus for me.

[mjc]

Not to say that it can't ever work...but, I've never heard/seen it done successfully. They aren't that closely related...plus hickories/pecans aren't very juglone tolerant (they aren't particularly sensitive, either...kind of in that middle ground where they won't be killed by it, but they won't do great there either). They are in the same 'tribe' but different subtribes and genus...so there is a chance that it could work. It's easier/higher success rate, grafting pecan onto seedling pecan or hickory.

[mnjrutherford]

::sigh:: Trees are like men, waay to complicated and to stiff to bend.

[steev]

Not gonna comment............

[mnjrutherford]

As Junior Asparagus would say, "I wuz hopin' you were gonna say that!"

[seedywen]

From the answers it would seem that grafting from proven cherry trees onto these young upstarts, is the surer way to produce fruit.

So far, I have two new projects slated for retirement; grafting fruit trees and making wine. The two of them go, hand in hand

However have started with the wine-making first...