Climate Scientists Are Giving Science a Bad Name

[prairiegardens]

Rat studies some time ago showed that crowding led directly to societal breakdown. Adult behaviour often became atypical, even to the point of some mothers abandoning their babies, fighting becoming much more frequent in situations which previously would have been resolved in other ways. I suspect that as the gap between rich and poor widens daily, this will result in the same effects. People react badly to their status being reduced through no fault of their own. So their attention is redirected to other groups as being to blame and that leads to the sort of racist and other targeting which diverts attention from the real issues and causes.

As far as social groups, someone has postulated the largest group that any human is able to participate fully with is 100 other people, most are much fewer. So when people claim to have a million friends on FB it has all sorts of implications, one being that they may be spending so much time gaining/keeping FB friends that they actually have few or none in their actual day to day life.

On a couple of FB groups I belong to, mostly having to do with homesteading and such, the same comment comes up all the time even among those still in the city and not isolated by geography, and that's loneliness. When people feel isolated they feel vulnerable, we are a tribal species. And when people feel vulnerable they usually become less trusting, less tolerant, and certainly less open to new and possibly potentially threatening new ideas and situations. Caveat there, unless their situation is so dire almost any alternative has to be a step up. Competition rather than cooperation is the order of the day with very few exceptions.

[steev]

Jocelyn: if there were only 2.7 billion humans on the planet when you were born, I must congratulate you on your longevity and continued interest in both gardening and life. When I was born, the population of California was about the same as the population of the twelve nearest SF Bay counties today; I kid you not, the traffic is abysmal, as is much of the behavior; common courtesy is no longer common; I don't even think it's so much tribal as individual interest that rules peoples' actions. It seems to me that population pressure drives people not to join, but to separate themselves from others; the whole idea of community falls before the need to separate oneself from the pressure of impinging humanity.

I agree that the remedy of this problem won't be pleasant; luckily, I'm old and may not see the worst of it.

[jocelyn]

There were 2.5 billion people the year I was born. 2.7 when I was in grade school......so, yes, I'm old...grin.

The big thing though, is that we are still here, as a species, grin.

[mskrieger]

Jun 5, 2018 11:57:16 GMT -5 jocelyn said:

There were 2.5 billion people the year I was born. 2.7 when I was in grade school......so, yes, I'm old...grin.

The big thing though, is that we are still here, as a species, grin.

You're old, but not THAT old. Merely the leading edge of the baby boomers. I bet steev predates you. ;P

I am quite a bit younger--the global pop was already 4.5bn when I came along. But I do have some perspective on some of these problems. In particular, the loneliness people complain of is a byproduct of our culture and the choices we are pushed into and the ethos we are sold. ('Sold' is definitely the operative word.) A lot of these choices also contribute to climate change. For example, the idea that everyone needs at least 850 sqft of personal space in a house (this is the average amount of space per person in an American household!), and that living with one's parents/extended family is undesirable, is both silly and environmentally destructive. It just forces everyone to buy more stuff, spend $ on daycare, eldercare, work harder, and feel more isolated...

But even when you realize that, it's hard to live differently. Everything just pushes you toward the standard American way of life. For example, when I only had 2 kids and my husband had lost his business and I was fired from my job, we moved in with my parents, he worked odd jobs and I stayed home with the kids. I met other people who were staying at home with the kids, gardened more, mended stuff, made do creatively, and had lots of time to volunteer in the community. I was always around if someone needed help, I hosted big family dinners every Friday night, and it was good.

But eventually my parents said 'you need to buy the house from us or move out', so I hustled and got a nice state employee job with a fancy title and a good salary and benefits that requires me to drive 350 miles a week, and so buy a second car, and have a 'smart' phone, and spend lots of money on nice clothes and gasoline and a mortgage (which basically siphons money off to a bank, money I could have given straight to my parents instead and kept it in the family). I am no longer around to volunteer or help people spontaneously, I don't see my kids as much and my husband and I are much more stressed than before.

But my parents and everyone else are very approving because I got a 'real' job and participate more in the formal economy, i.e. am burning more fossil fuels and have more debt.

It's insane but it's what we're socialized to do.

[mskrieger]

also, just cause we're talking about population, I'll come right out here and admit I have 4 kids. But I'm raising them to live on only 10% of the resources of an average American, so I don't feel guilty about it.

[jocelyn]

Yup, born in '52, you nailed it..grin.

Culture defines what we NEED to have.
I stayed home, worked part time self employed and we figured if I went to work full time, it would cost the household about 17 thousand of my take home pay.

I stayed home.

[steev]

I'm no boomer; I'm a war baby.

[jocelyn]

Hi Steev, then I'll throw your compliment right back at you, grin. Long may we ALL garden too:)
Gardening is good for the soul. Never mind being good for the belly and the pocketbook, grin.

[jocelyn]

Oh, and Mskrieger, I imagine you took whatever opportunities were available, same as I did.
Opportunities differ depending on where you live. Mine included doing books, hatching eggs as a custom hatchery,
selling little trees from the house and selling nuts and fruit.............because I could, in this area.

[steev]

Right. Replicable peer-reviewed data is not nearly as reliable as endlessly repeated BS.