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Post by pugs on Jan 23, 2009 18:56:53 GMT -5
Stands on soapbox.
I hate it when a PVP has expired on a seed and catalogs still list it as that. Like Dill's Atlantic Giant, many catalogs still list it as PVP, but it expired 05/30/2004. Five years later and they still claim it is PVP. Ugh.
Gets off soapbox.
Pugs
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Post by winter unfazed on Jan 25, 2009 10:15:17 GMT -5
They do that because they don't bother to check their information.
I also hate it when catalogs propagate inaccurate names, especially scientific ones. A couple of years ago someone (I don't know who or how) mangled the name "Cosmos sulphureus" into "Cosmea sulfereous". Ever since then, Cosmea sulfereous has been cropping up in seed catalogs all over.
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Post by paquebot on Jan 25, 2009 19:55:53 GMT -5
They do that because they don't bother to check their information. I also hate it when catalogs propagate inaccurate names, especially scientific ones. A couple of years ago someone (I don't know who or how) mangled the name "Cosmos sulphureus" into "Cosmea sulfereous". Ever since then, Cosmea sulfereous has been cropping up in seed catalogs all over. What happens is that the retail seed companies follow what's supplied by the wholesalers. We've noted a number of times where the identical wrong spelling, description, photo, or history showed up for a new variety in several places at once. Catalog editors did exactly what every editor is supposed to do and followed the copy. Martin
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Post by kimikat on Jan 26, 2009 22:23:38 GMT -5
Shoot...when the PVP expires is the time to rescue that variety. Liberate those genetics... Return them to the home gardeners to do with as they please.
Although....expiration is not necessarily necessary either.
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Post by pugs on Jan 26, 2009 22:48:15 GMT -5
Martin,
Maybe you can figure this one out. Jung's listed a Marget (sp?) sweet pepper last year as PVP applied for, yet I can't find it in the listing as even Application Pending and I just looked.
Jung's is also one of the company still listing Dill's as PVP.
Black Pearl pepper is PVP by the US government, yet I've never seen it listed in a catalog as PVP. Go figure.
Pugs
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Post by winter unfazed on Mar 8, 2009 10:04:02 GMT -5
If it's never listed as PVP, that probably means that the company gave away its PVP rights.
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Post by pugs on Mar 8, 2009 15:39:21 GMT -5
WU,
If a PVP has been applied for, it shows up in the on-line listing. The status changes over time. As this pepper was in Jung's Catalog last spring with the note that the PVP has been applied for, one would think that it would show up in the on-line listing by now.
I've seen them where the status is 'application abandoned'. This one just isn't there at all.
Pugs
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Post by macmex on Mar 9, 2009 11:06:22 GMT -5
I have a question about plant variety patenting. It's been my understanding that if it is patented, then it's technically illegal to reproduce, even for personal use. Is this so? This year, for the first time in a decade, I purchased another variety of pea (Eclipse), just to try out. Then, after "the check was in the mail," so to speak, I discovered that Eclipse is patented! Ugh!!!
BTW, the pea we've been growing for the last 8 years is Sugaree Snap Pea, developed by Dr. Kapular. We LOVE this pea. It's a delicious snap, and we haven't even noticed germination problems in cool soil.
George
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potagere
gopher
On slopes of the Jura nr Geneva, Switz. Zone 7a/b, but colder microclimate. About 52 sq m in veggies
Posts: 46
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Post by potagere on Mar 9, 2009 15:27:30 GMT -5
That is not exactly true, macmex.
Others will be better searchers than I am , but I don't readily retrieve a patent on this pea. Are you sure it is patented, or just PV registered?
In any case, you can reproduce any patented plant variety (or, even moreso any PV registered plant) for personal use. You cannot reproduce it to sell the seed, cuttings or plants thereof.
Jim
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Post by flowerpower on Mar 10, 2009 4:49:49 GMT -5
If a PVP has been applied for, it shows up in the on-line listing. The status changes over time. Pugs How long does the PVP status of a variety last?
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Post by americangardener on Mar 10, 2009 6:10:29 GMT -5
Flower... I do beleive it's 20 years from the time it is approved. www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/plant/index.htmlramps.uspto.gov/eram/patentMaintFees.dowww.freepatentsonline.com/PP05812.htmlYou can find out all about it yourself in the links above. I like that last one. If you know the PVP number you can look it up. I've done a couple dozen in the past. And you know what? Every single one of em will say that application abandoned or withdrawn or denied. And you know what as well? Every company that submited an application will still have that variety listed as PVP0000 applied. Just replace the zeros with the actual number. You know what i mean there. It's more likely than not just a big deception to keep you from knowing the variety is already in public domain. Obviously no one wants you to know that they withdrew their application or it was denied... so they just keep that PVP applied for, or pending or whatever in their listings forever. Anyways.. that's been my experience.. the ones i have found where the PVP was actually accepted usually ran out years and years ago. There's somewhere i read about the numbers of PVP's applied for for each year. It wasn't a whole lot and what was applied for, from the statistics i read very few ever were still pending or accepted. I think most companys just do the inital application then drop it so they won't have to pay all that money for the actual patent... why do that when they can list a (PVP applied for) next to a variety name and never take it off? You'll have to read the rules and see if you can find out what they say about advertizing something as a PVP when it's abandoned.. but whatever it is.. i'm sure it's not followed or enforced.
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Post by macmex on Mar 10, 2009 9:32:08 GMT -5
Thanks folks. This is very helpful.
George
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Post by pugs on Mar 10, 2009 20:56:04 GMT -5
FP, Some are 18 and some are 20 years. I don't know if the two years were added later, or if there is some other reason. If you go to this page you will see some are abandoned, some pending, some are issued : www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/pvp4.pl?Pepper%20200400329%20200800333And if you go to this page you will see that the pepper Black Pearl's PVP expires 20 years after it was issued or applied for, I'm not sure which it is. www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/showpvp.pl?pvpno=200500020From the FAQ : 10. Is there any penalty for claiming a variety is plant-variety protected when it is not? Answer: In Section 128 of the Plant Variety Protection Act (pdf) - a cease and desist order may be issued; followed by a fine if the order is violated. Please provide the PVPO with more information if you are aware of any alleged violations. In particular you should search for Sec. 128.1 False Marking; Cease and Desist Orders. This doesn't address the issue about ones applied for. Also to the question can you save seed from a PVP: 12. What actions are people prohibited from taking with a protected variety? Answer: Without explicit consent from the owner, a person is prohibited from: selling, marketing, offering, delivering, consigning, exchanging, or exposing the variety for sale. In addition, a person is prohibited from soliciting an offer to buy the variety or transfer or possess it in any way. It is also illegal to import or export the variety, sexually multiply it, propagate it by tuber, use the variety in producing (as distinguished from developing) a hybrid, or condition the variety for the purpose of propagation. 13. Does this mean that the home gardener or farmer cannot propagate the seed of a protected variety and save it for future planting? Answer: Under provisions of the PVP law and regulations growers and home gardeners can grow, and save seed for their own future planting, any legally purchased protected variety they wish. However some protected varieties that are sold may have other limitations due to patents or contracts and may not be saved for future planting. Pugs
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