Cyclanthera

[orflo]

These are interesting plants, visually attactive and easy to grow, some of them re-seed themselves in my garden. Culture is comparable to early cucumbers, but most of the cyclanthera varieties grow bigger and wilder, and the prefer a good trellis.
They taste best when they are picked young (taste is comparable to cucumbers), and can be used in any way cucumbers are used, even added on pizza, ...I grow some plants each year, and they give me a very high crop (with the exception of the spineless lady's slipper, I need to do some selection on that one, it's just unproductive). The spines don't need to be removed, except if you want to eat the big 'caihua' raw, these spines are a bit harder compared to other varieties. There are some more varieties circulating, I saw a 'caihua' that is much larger than the one on the pictures below, up to 20 cms. These big ones are usually eaten with all kind of stuffings. The exploding one is really exploding, seeds fly off like a rocket (watch your eyes!), and I've found seedlings as far as 7 metres from their growth place!
As far as edibility is concerned: the 'fat baby' and 'lady's slipper's' are the best ones, provided they are picked young, the caihua is also good (again, picked when they are small), the exploding one isn't really very good, but it's fun!!
Strange thing: a few weeks ago I received some seeds from Columbia, mentioning:pepino, latin name: cyclanthera brachystachya, while we know the pepino over here as solanum muricatum...;that's how local names can be used for other things in different areas...
caihua:


exploding cucumber (cyclanthera brachystachya)

achocca 'fat baby' (cycl. brachystachya)

lady's slipper (cyclanthera pedata)

[PatrickW]

Frank, I think you know I grew Achocha Fat Baby this year. My seeds were from Real Seeds, but they must have come from your garden before that. When I visited your garden this year, I also tasted one you were growing, which was delicious. You're plants were also much healthier looking than mine.

Easy to grow and productive, without a doubt. There are also few plants as easy to save seeds from.

Taste on the other hand, for me and what I grew in my garden, ranged from uninteresting to not very nice. For me the taste was close to a gourd, and on the strong side. The plants ended up taking a lot of space by the end of the season, with long rambling and fast growing vines extending 2-3 meters or more that can damage or smother tender plants. Even in your garden, the plant was pretty large.

I did a post about this on my blog: www.patnsteph.net/weblog/?p=385

The feedback I got for the two or three other people I know who grew this was pretty similar to mine. I know seeds are going out to other people in Europe this year who will be growing it, so it'll be interesting to see what they think.

Especially since I tasted what you grew, and I know it was nice, I might try growing this again. My priority would be trying to understand the growing conditions that effect the taste, and seeing if I could get it to taste better. If I couldn't get the taste right, I would give it up pretty quickly.

The novelty is certainly there and it's a fun plant to grow in many ways, maybe good for kids.

[grungy]

Is there going to be some seeds available for trading?
Cheers,
Val aka grungy

[americangardener]

That's some great info Frank...

Just happens that i'm planning on growing the lady's slipper next year. database.prota.org/PROTAhtml/Cyclanthera%20pedata_En.htm

I just got some seeds from a trade from Holland. So, i'm looking forward to trying them out.

I do recall when i was a child living in Maine we had what must have been the Fat boy variety growing wild all over the place. I never knew they were edible... I do know they were fun to throw around as kids. And that they would climb way up in the trees. And that they were loaded with those spike little cucmber type things. Least i beleive now that those were Cyclantheras.

Anyways.. it'll be interesting to see what these lady slippers turn out as. I sure hope they taste good at least.

Dave

[PatrickW]

I can certainly send seeds to anyone interested.

Dave, is your friend in Holland named Nevi? I just got an email from someone by that name who said Dave gave them my name.

Huh, Dave? Dave who? Now I think I know which Dave...

[americangardener]

Nov 9, 2008 10:57:31 GMT -5 PatrickW said:

I can certainly send seeds to anyone interested.

Dave, is your friend in Holland named Nevi? I just got an email from someone by that name who said Dave gave them my name.

Huh, Dave? Dave who? Now I think I know which Dave...

I know Nevi.. and i'm probably the dave mentioned. Although i don't recall giving anyone your name. I may have given out your blog link somewhere though.

But, no Nevi isn't the source for the Lady's slippers.. it's another friend who goes by the nickname of Ajla. Ajla and Nevi are friends.. so i wouldn't be surpised if Nevi has some of the same seeds she does.

Now which seeds do you have? You got any of the other ones besides ladys slipper ones?

Dave

[ottawagardener]

I was thinking of trying this but the only cultivar that I found locally was lady's slipper and I would prefer something productive. In terms of taste and growing conditions: What kind of soil do you have Patrick and Frank? Mine is sandy loam. Most years we get adequate rain that we don't have to do too much supplemental watering and we get a fair amount of sun. Frost to frost ranges from 4-5 months.

[canadamike]

Dave, the wild plant looking like it and growing here and in your area is Echinocystis lobata, called wild cucumber. It can induce hallucinatory intoxications.

So , if you try it , feel bad and see pink flying elephants in the sky you'll know why!

[orflo]

And, yes, with the exception of lady's slipper, I also have seeds to distribute (I do have some lady's slipper, but not very much, and I think I did place them on the SSE list this year, so order them at :www.everyonesseeds ;D ;D). I grow the plants in quite heavy loam soil, and , Patrick already told you, they can have pretty long shoots. These are however easily pruned. Unless you live in a very cold climate, don't put them in a greenhouse, they are able to overtake the whole thing (or, if you like pruning, you just might want to do that ;D).
I usually mix up the things: peppers and tomatoes and cyclantheras, and whatever, they do taste OK then. And don't eat them when the fruits have become too big, taste is really better when they're small . I think the cyclantheras are promising, they do need some more selection to get a place beside the more-known things, in some parts of South-America they are eaten regularly, I will try some of these varieties in 2009 (some of them are still daylength-sensitive...)

[PatrickW]

Dave: I have Achocha Fat Baby.

OG: I have loose sandy soil, and there were no problems with productivity.

[canadamike]

See Dave, now you can sell a ''wild buzz''.

You owe me one!!

[americangardener]

Nov 9, 2008 21:39:44 GMT -5 canadamike said:

Dave, the wild plant looking like it and growing here and in your area is Echinocystis lobata, called wild cucumber. It can induce hallucinatory intoxications.

So , if you try it , feel bad and see pink flying elephants in the sky you'll know why!

Ha.. but you misread my earlier post.. i said when i was a kid and living in Maine. I've yet to see anything like that growing wild around here in michigan. Now, i'm just glad i never did try to eat any when i was a kid.
To me they didn't look very appetizing... sorta like luffas with large hard seeds on the inside and all spikey on the outside.

And i'm ok without seeing pink flying elephants.. i have enough of a problem with seagulls dive bombin when we go to the park.. don't need any pink elephants coming after me .

Nov 10, 2008 22:46:36 GMT -5 @greeneyes said:

Dave,Mike,I grew up around wild cucumber,so I called my know-it-all brother about it.He remembers it a little too well,if you ask me..I liked the pretty vines,apparently he liked the seeds,Said if you eat them before they are ripe,you get a good high off of it for several hours.It only takes one...Jeez and back then I thought I was corrupting him by getting him to smoke catnip...It does look just like"fat baby".

Now who the heck thinks of these things? How does anyone get up the nerve to try and get high off of eating or smoking something they know nothing about? Or i wonder does it just happen by accident. I know i for one wouldn't be going around poppin wild mushrooms into my mouth wondering which would be a good buzz, or even which would be good for eating. I'd just be too afraid of the consequences. But, since your brother says it's ok.. i guess i'll try it.. NOT... no catnip for me either.

And Michel.. i'll owe ya one after you do the testing for me. Then you'd have to find me some seeds to sell. But, i think i'm ok just selling veggies thank you. If i really wanted to promote that kind of stuff... i'd probably have better luck selling seeds for medical cannabis.. it's legal here now you know. With a perscription a person can now legally grow three plants at a time so long as they're kept out of sight of children. And heck i could get 10 bucks a seed for that easy... and think of all the fun i'd have cleaning my seeds for sale.

But, nope.. just veggies for me.. that's enough to handle for now. Maybe after you do some extensive testing on the other uses for the wild cucumber i'll be ready to list some in a few years.

Dave

[PatrickW]

Dave, you know the same politics with OP/heirloom and F1s apply to cannabis now. OP varieties are getting harder to come by, and it's the F1s that get 10 bucks a seed. There are even large seed companies patenting their F1s, and giving them names that are registered trademarks in the Netherlands. There's big money in selling these seeds now.

The newer varieties are really bad for you however. I made a post about it here:

www.patnsteph.net/weblog/?p=330

[americangardener]

That's a very interesting post Patrick.. thanks! But, no, i'm not seriously thinking of marketing any cannabis seeds. I think our law is a little too new to start testing the boundaries on that. Maybe a few years down the road i'd consider doing it. I do know there's really big money in the seeds. Look at Marc Emery up there in Canada.. he's made millions selling seeds. I've bought seeds from him and from amsterdam in my younger days... just to study of course! And i'm like Rebsie.. i saw her comment on your blog.. now why would anyone want the most powerfull buzz possible? Guess i'm the same way with weed as i am with drinking.. i don't drink hard liquor simply because my goal isn't to get as drunk as possible, as fast as possible.. it's to socialize and have a good time. I wouldn't be interested in trying something like those F1's for that reason... but who knows.. maybe one day if the laws permit it i'd try a few to sell. I still have to consider the climatic conditions here.. and the best one i've found for that is Northern Lights or Afghani. Gotta remember it's just the one little state here where i could even have a market for those.

But, enough about that.. what i was really trying to say to Michel is that i'm not considering selling seeds for any other purpose other than growing for food right now. Sure i'd like to get some novelty items like the Stevia plants and MIRACLE BERRY ( Synsepalum dulcificum) and all kinds of new things i see all our european friends here talking about. That's what i'm looking for mostly is edible novelty items. That's why i'm gonna try the ladys slippers and things like that.

It is interesting to see that there are some other properties for those wild cucumbers... but i sure as heck wouldn't be promoting that on my website. It's nice to know, but i wouldn't tell anyone about it myself... just too much risk for me to be promoting something i have no real idea what the effects would be. Now if it's edible.. which i don't think the one we're talking about is.. i'd sell it for that purpose..that is if it has a taste and a use. But, other than that it'd have to wait till i branch out into doing flowers and other ornamental plants... and still i wouldn't mention the side effects.. it's just not the type of customers i'm hoping to attract.

Now,, maybe once Michel is done with all the testing... maybe in a couple years.. i'll expand into other markets.

[canadamike]

I'll try to find somebody to smoke it!