An allium section?

[ottawagardener]

I was wondering if we should add an Allium section to our growing list? Maybe just because I am obsessed with the things.

Telsing

[canadamike]

I second the motion

[Jim]

third

[mjc]

Allium section...sounds fun

[PatrickW]

How did we make it so long without an allium section??

[pugs]

Well, it looks like there is one now! You make a wish and it is granted.

Talk about service.

Pugs

[ottawagardener]

Thanks Alan!

[canadamike]

It is not Alan, it is ME.

Well, heuhhh! Not really me, but since I feel like needing a pat on the back these days, please folks, jus tpretend and congratulate me ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Seriously, congrats to the hot beautiful one from Ottawa for the idea.

I would like to take the occasion to all those to whom I sent the rare accessions of alliums from GRIN last year to think of me a bit.

I split the seeds equally in 8 parts and disseminated them, but my lil' greenhouse got caught in a freak wind, almost a tornado, and I lost everything in it. I also soon later lost my puter and the files without having put them on a memory key, which anyway I almost always forget to do... homo sapiens subspecies computosaurus I am

I am very saddened with what happened to my alliums growing, it was soo precious to me, and the curator of the allium collection was so nice to me and helped me sooo much in selecting, I ould appreciate if I got some seeds/plants back to at least be a witness to her of the results of her kind work.

I sincerelu think there is much progress to be made in the field of gastronomy with alliums.

The nice thing about the onion/garlic family is they are most of the time used in small quantities, so you don't need a huge crop to make an impact, and fine restaurants are wild about these ''different but not so different'' kind of things.

I know for a fact that ''ORPREÏ'' from Orflo can make a chef quite smitten easily...

I wanted to explore alliums from day one the day Frank sent me the seeds of ORPREÏ, but even much more once I got that kind of culinary orgasm only gourmets or true gardeners can experience.

[paquebot]

Allium forums always seem to be an afterthought. There were 3 of us who lobbied for some time on GW before Spike finally agreed. It's a slow one and may still have almost every thread back to when it started.

Martin

[canadamike]

Hello Martin, and Happy New Year. Well, I think a guy like you and a couple of lunatics like us can make it interesting. It will never be the biggest thing, but we can at least learn from each other.

I'll translate a french proverb here: the best ointments are in the small jars...

Could we have the luxury of a report on your wife , please???

[mnjrutherford]

Mike, I'm not prepared at the moment to lend allium aid, but in future I think I will? Pugs sent me a TON of garlic, well a ton in my world view of things at least.

BUT, I have some questions now as I am in the learning curve.

1. Conflict of information:
a. Don't plant allium in the same area each year. Rotate with at LEAST 4 year intervals between planting.
b. Naturalizing
I would like to naturalize, but my thoughts was more like planting strawberries, asparagus, and small alliums (garlic & shallots) around the trees along the creek. This is a semi shaded area that we want to turn into a sort of "park".

2. I have read a couple articles (not here in the forum) that have made me think that my first harvest will be "small" and that I should wait for the second year to replant. This just doesn't make any sense to me at all. Presuming I planted at the correct time and that I harvest at the correct time, shouldn't the garlic in particular attain a "normal" size even if it is the first year grown?

I would also like to try to get some of the more specialized shallots you have mentioned previously.

[PatrickW]

Hi Jo,

There are annual or biennial alliums and perennial alliums.

The perrenials are much more disease resistant, and as far as I'm aware, with most perennials in general, rotation is not really much of an issue. I've heard advice along the lines if you are going to plant a fruit tree, you shouldn't plant it where the same kind stood previously, etc, but in generally rotations are not an issue with perennials.

When you are planning rotations for annuals or biennials, you do have to consider if a perennial has grown in that spot previously in recent years. For example, if you have a fresh piece of land not used for alliums in a while, you could first grow onions that are biennial, then follow that with perennial onions. Perhaps this is a little risky, but perennial onions rarely get plant diseases only sometimes act as carriers. On the other hand you would not want to first grow perennial onions for a year or two, then switch to ordinary onions.

When you are planting clones, like garlic, diseases are a particular concern. This is because diseases that may otherwise be soil borne, and not carried in seeds, can be reintroduced every year by the cloves. Garlic can also get diseases like white rot, that once established, can remain in the ground for decades. Viruses are also a particular problem. The only real defence against these are proper rotations, a minimum of 3-4 years between plantings, but many people including me try to never use the same ground twice for garlic if possible. Garlic can be grown very densely, for example cloves 2-3" apart in rows 1' apart, so it's possible to grow a lot in a small space, then avoid using that spot again for as long as possible.

And yes, garlic quickly adapts to it's local climate, usually in the course of 3-4 years. By replanting the largest cloves, from the largest bulbs, you are selecting for your garden and your planting stock will improve over time. If you ever get garlic from somewhere else, don't give up on it until you've given it a chance to adapt to your garden. This is why it's always best to get garlic from a neighbor, rather than from somewhere far away. Also, keep in mind that if you get too many different garlics from too many different people, the chances of introducing things like viruses increases.