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Post by heidihi on Sept 13, 2010 7:43:52 GMT -5
can you tell me honestly is it ok to grow these in your garden? Is it a felony in the US to grow these pretty things in your garden? and how on earth can I know for sure that what I have is actually an opium poppy? ..they match the photos online exactly! .....I have googled... it read about it and find nothing but conflicting info ..I had no idea I had them a friend gave me a bunch of different kinds of poppy seeds...told me some where opium poppies but not to worry....I adore the flowers and love the pods just as much! they look so pretty in the garden! ..so I just let them go and reseed ..they are not at all invasive for me but they fill in areas where I really like having those great spots of color so then my bliss was ruined when "omg you are growing opium! That is a felony you know!!!" well really no I had no idea I was going to get in trouble and still do not know for sure ..I mean seriously from what I read online (and if anyone is following me on google it is going to look a little wierd because I googled all kinds of things about opium and poppies!!!) so do you know the truth? is there another thread on this issue because I searched and could not find one? .. could someone enlighten me about these poppies? I really was collecting the seed to use in muffins and stuff ...should my grandson be eating poppy seeds from my garden? .....I have all kinds of poppies growing and thought the seeds were all edible so I mixed them up when I harvested them ... I know UA's for work are out for a while!  good grief I just love poppies and did not even think it was an issue but the more I read the more confused I get thanks for any and all advice! it would be silly if a cop tore up my garden over some pretty poppies!!! some sites say they are only illegal over a certian number and if you score the pods and collect the sap ..well I am not doing that ...some say growing them at all is illegal ..I do not want that! ..some say it is all bullsh$t and I can grow them freely help? |
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Post by johno on Sept 13, 2010 9:29:16 GMT -5
From my limited understanding of the subject... they are technically illegal. BUT, it really depends on local law enforcement. General understanding is that a few ornamental flowers do not attract attention, but a poppy field certainly might. I wouldn't lose sleep over it. If the local boys in blue were somehow to notice and drop by for an inspection, razor cuts on the pods would not be good. Otherwise, no big deal. There are numerous types, as far as identifying from a picture goes. Baker Creek sells a few, many other seed companies do as well. You'd think if it was a big concern for law enforcement, they would start there.
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Post by mjc on Sept 13, 2010 10:48:28 GMT -5
Papaver somniferum is the 'Opium poppy'...it is also a common garden flower (used to be known as the common garden poppy) and breadseed poppy. The seeds are the same as what is used in muffins, bagels, cakes and so on. There is no real distinction between the poppies grown for opium production and those grown for ornamental or culinary uses, they are the same thing. There are probably hundreds, if not thousands of varieties/cultivars of P somniferum and some of the prettiest ones are also the ones that are most often used for opium production or seed production (they have nice large pods, in addition to very showy flowers).
Papaver californicum (Califonia poppy), Papaver nudicaule (Iceland poppy), Papaver orientale (Oriental poppy), Papaver rhoeas (corn poppy, Flanders poppy) all can be used as garden flowers...but they are not edible or have any where near the variety of colors and forms as P somniferum.
The whole legality issue, at least in the US is extremely murky, considering that many botanical gardens, public/government (mostly city and state) buildings, universities and other institutions grow them for ornamental purposes. And the culinary use is still perfectly legal (although you can get in trouble with your employer if you eat too many poppyseed bagels before submitting to a drug test...). Technically, yes, it is illegal to grow them...but at the same time, almost all levels of law enforcement totally ignore the law on it and ignore the poppies themselves (one of the most glaring examples of that was seeing poppies in the ground around a state police station, here, in WV this past spring...). Also part of the problem is that most law enforcement agencies have absolutely no clue what to look for, and if you contact local authorities, you will probably get as many different and conflicting answers as you get people to talk to about it. Yes, it is legal to buy the seed in the grocery store (although there is a move to sterilize the culinary seed, it doesn't seem to be getting anywhere).
And, yes, most of the poppies offered by Baker Creek and other seed companies are P. somniferum, although, BC does have a couple of others...like the Flanders Poppy (P. rhoeas). Most other seed companies are similar, with the bulk of their offerings being P. somniferum.
This is also a prime example of how our 'drug policy' in this country is broken. It's a rare day, when I'll admit that Great Britain is doing something saner than the US (hey, you UK folks can probably back me up with long, elaborate tales of government insanity, right?), but the way they handle poppy growing over there is much more reasonable and sane than the constant threat of some bureaucrat wanting to make a name for himself suddenly deciding to crack down on all the poppy growers around him.
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remy
gopher
Posts: 44
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Post by remy on Sept 13, 2010 12:14:26 GMT -5
The reason it is not a problem to grow papaver sominferum varieties is you would need to be growing a heck of a lot of them to make drugs. A few in your garden isn't going to make heroin. The following is take from a site. I do not know this off the top of my head, lol. ~ Approximately 13 kilograms of opium, from one hectare(approx. 2 1/2 acres) of opium poppies, are needed to produce each morphine block that is 1.3 kilograms (3 lbs). So unless your garden looks like the massive poppy field in the Wizard of Oz, no one is going to come knocking on your door  Remy |
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Post by atash on Sept 13, 2010 22:18:11 GMT -5
I agree with the other posters; technically illegal to grow, but widely ignored. On rare occasions, I have heard of enforcement but all they did was rip them out of a lady's yard (much to her irritation).
It is, however, legal to sell the seed, so that's how the seed companies get away with it.
I grew the big purple one from Hungary and got lots of seed, but it was all bland. No flavor. My soil must be missing something it needs to make good seed. I like poppyseeds for baking.
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Post by stevil on Sept 14, 2010 2:50:42 GMT -5
Papaver californicum (Califonia poppy), Papaver nudicaule (Iceland poppy), Papaver orientale (Oriental poppy), Papaver rhoeas (corn poppy, Flanders poppy) all can be used as garden flowers...but they are not edible or have any where near the variety of colors and forms as P somniferum. However, Papaver rhoeas is a very commonly used spring green in Italy and other Mediterranean countries. I've seen piles of this herb on vegetable markets in the springtime in Italy (Venice, Florence). As far as I can find out it has very low toxicity and is considered perfectly safe, at least when harvested young. |
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Post by bobinthebul on Sept 14, 2010 2:53:26 GMT -5
I remember a few cases of old ladies getting in to trouble in Seattle during one particularly absurd wave of anti-drug panic. But generally you see them all over the place. A better reason for not growing them in your front yard at least is that there are people out there who do process them, and rather than grow them themselves, they snatch them from others' gardens. I remember a story of a woman who was looking out her bay window one morning at her garden, when a small truck stopped on the street. Out of the back hopped a guy who went walking into her garden, put his arms around her entire stand of poppies and carried them off. By the time she had picked her jaw up off the floor, the truck was driving off. Of course people like this also don't care what else they trample to get their prize.
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Post by stevil on Sept 14, 2010 2:59:54 GMT -5
I once received a notification in the post that I had been reported to the police and it turned out that it was due to Opium Poppy seed that an internet seed trader had sent me and the customs had informed the police. Charges weren't pressed, so I'm still a free man  I also heard of others being reported as seed company Thompson and Morgan was sending out free poppy seed with all orders! The situation was ridiculous though. Although illegal to import, Papaver somniferum seed were easily available from gardening centres and supermarkets as bread seed poppies (those seed germinated, I tried). The authorities after newspaper articles finally changed the rules and it's now perfectly legal to grow (small amounts). |
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Post by flowerpower on Sept 14, 2010 6:51:56 GMT -5
If the local boys in blue were somehow to notice and drop by for an inspection, razor cuts on the pods would not be good. Otherwise, no big deal. This is when it becomes a felony in NY. Otherwise growing plants and saving seed is perfectly legal. And always refer to them as Breadseed Poppies if anyone asks. |
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Post by heidihi on Sept 14, 2010 8:26:27 GMT -5
LOL so the answer is yes and no I live in the south puget sound and see poppies everywhere ..It just hit me that maybe it was not legal so as I said I checked online and got even more confused so what you are saying is set this one on the shelf ..grow my poppies (I do have a lot of them) and just do not score the pods and harvest the opium! ok I won't! I am sure people do however! I saw the Myth Busters where they did the UA for poppy seeds and yup it did cause a postive UA ...I am an RN and I know when folks are going for drug UA's we absolutely tell them no poppy seeds I love how poppy seeds taste in baking and would like to use these so if it is ok to just mix them up and use them I will ..they taste very nutty actually and there are a billion seeds in those things thanks so much for all the wonderful answers I am just going to not worry about it |
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Post by nuts on Sept 14, 2010 12:45:59 GMT -5
Sorry to be a bit off topic.
I did a google search for UA.
University of Alabama? United Airlines?
RN
Royal Navy?
Registered Nurse?(that might be plausible)
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Post by mjc on Sept 14, 2010 13:52:00 GMT -5
Sorry to be a bit off topic. I did a google search for UA. University of Alabama? United Airlines? RN Royal Navy? Registered Nurse?(that might be plausible) UA = Urine analysis... Take the little cup and provide a sample? |
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Post by heidihi on Sept 14, 2010 21:49:39 GMT -5
I am sorry ..yes I am a registered nurse and MJC got the UA ..I do not even think I just type
I will be more careful!
poppy seeds show up in urine tests as opiate postiive
that is about my entire pre.. this sudden concern I may be growing something illegal..knowledge
that is why I asked about feeding my poppy seeds to my old grandson ..I just thought oh oh!!! what if there was some opium in the seed? I had no idea?
I let him dump some in his mouth right from the pod ..(only after I did and did not die!)
then I went neurotic and started doing all kinds of searches ..making me more neurotic!!!
phew
I am not sure if I feel any better but I would hope our cops are keeping an eye on some of the other more important things ..
and no scoring the pods ;D
you know people do that!!!
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Post by mjc on Sept 14, 2010 22:25:58 GMT -5
I am sorry ..yes I am a registered nurse and MJC got the UA ..I do not even think I just type My wife is an RN...I'm somewhat used to decoding 'nurse-speak'... |
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Post by nuts on Sept 15, 2010 18:29:23 GMT -5
Thanks,heidihi and mjc,now I understand some more.
If you want him to sleep, give him a handful ;D ;D ;D ;D
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I also heard of others being reported as seed company Thompson and Morgan was sending out free poppy seed with all orders! The situation was ridiculous though. Although illegal to import, Papaver somniferum seed were easily available from gardening centres and supermarkets as bread seed poppies (those seed germinated, I tried). The authorities after newspaper articles finally changed the rules and it's now perfectly legal to grow (small amounts). 