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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2013 10:23:54 GMT -5
Andre, the splotched Peruvian corn on the far right is an example of the Piscorunto race from Peru (from Quechua "Pessoc-runtum" for "bird's egg"). Blueadzuki, yes the reddish corn second from the left could very well be from Cuzco Gigante, as there are red-tinged varieties within the breed, as well as black pericarp and red-splotched pericarp types. If anyone on this thread wants Peruvian corn, I have a long day-adapted Cuzco population that I'd be willing to trade. I can't ship internationally though; I have trouble getting things by customs.  If anyone is interested, send me a message. |
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Post by blueadzuki on Jun 28, 2013 20:36:02 GMT -5
A selection of my own Peruvian corn finds (again this is all I have; so please, no seed requests quite yet) This is pretty much everything I have, with one exception (see below)  From top to bottom 1(Top). A selection of the colored Huyacatay (mountain type) Peruvian corn. While this looks like an impressive amount, bear in mind that getting this much required uncountable hours of searching through the corn bin; colored kernels are quite rare in the commercialy available stock. nealry everytihng in this pile I actually only got yesterday (I was a good hunting day) 2 (Middle left) This pile actually came from a single cob from back when I found all those cobs are few years ago. While it had terrible color (I think there was a grand total of one non white kernel, which I planted ages ago) I saved this one due to an interesting kernel arrangement; its eight rows had the somewhat flanged appearance that I usually only saw on very very primitive cobs (read the kind you see that are practically teosinte) so i considered it worth keeping, though for a planting of it's own (which I why I still have it, while the better stuff was long ago planted and destroyed by pests) 3 (Middle Right) my collection of colored Cuzco. It's a little hard to see, but some of those kernels have purple blotches or speckles. Hard as it is to find colored mountain type Peruvian, finding colored Cuzco in the commercial batches is almost undheard of, which is why the pile is so small. 4. (Bottom Left) An example of the fact that cross comtamination can occur anywhere. These twelve chinmarkrd sweet kernels were on one of the cobs I found in the original haul. I Have to assume the sweet side is Maiz Chulpe (Peruviant sweetcorn) as opposed to the kind we have here (anyone know if peruviant sweet corns have the same problems with day length as the flurs do) 5. (Bottom right) Examples of the "turkey feather" pattern I used to find sometime. I have no idea if this is genetic or the result of some sort of damage; I suppose the answer will come when and if I ever get any cobs of my own, and see if the pattern transmits. Not Depicted One cob of a huacatay corn with the deep purple pericarp (and leaves) of Maiz morado. I didn't scan this one becuse it is by now waay to brittle to risk putting in the scan (however if anyone is curious there is probably a picture of it somewhere in the back of the thread, back when I got it) Presumaby this is all white underneath, but to find out I'd have to take the cob apart soak it and peel it, and I don't want to do that since it is currently the only whole cob I have left. |
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Post by steev on Jun 28, 2013 21:03:13 GMT -5
Blue, I am continually blown away by the nerdly attention you invest in this stuff; thanks so much for your efforts. It's a dirty job, but someone has to think about it.
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Post by Andre on Jul 4, 2013 8:34:14 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2013 9:45:35 GMT -5
Thanks for the link, Andre.  The long-eared Piricinco from Loreto is my favorite breed of maize. It is a low-yielding race but a great source of resistance to fungal pathogens and viruses, with some collections rivaling the levels found in the excellent Caribbean materials used by tropical breeders. Interestingly, Piricinco and its related corns in Brasil and Bolivia (Entrelaçado, Coroico, and Coroico Amarillo) are a unique racial complex (the Amazonian Interlocked Flour complex) that was separated from all other maize for thousands of years, perhaps up to 4 millennia. Due to the isolation, it developed 2 traits not found in any other breed: multiple aleurone layers and a thin pericarp. Here is an article about it.: www.agron.missouri.edu/mnl/64/191galinat.html(note: Coroico, Piricinco, and Entrelaçado are different names for the same race of maize based upon its geographical origin.) |
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Post by 12540dumont on Jun 5, 2014 14:32:15 GMT -5
Seriously? You mean you never folded corn? What on earth do they teach in home ec these days. There is no "gentle" way of folding varieties together. What you would do is find a highly similar variety and cross your low producing corn with it in hopes of improving the overall production. Presume you are using a variety like Floriani Red Flint polenta corn. Select a complementary variety like Abenaki flint to cross it with. Floriani is a red corn with slight white caps, conic seed form, slight conic ear form, which means is could very well be derived from the Conica race group. Abenaki is a mix of yellow and red kernels that are oval flint and very early maturity. You would select the red kernels to cross with the Floriani. The traits you would like to combine include the high cooking quality of the Floriani with improved vigor and early maturity from Abenaki. Start by making a small cross involving 20 or 30 plants of each variety for example planting the Floriani 2 weeks before the Abenaki to account for the difference in maturity. When the corn starts to tassel, pull out all the Floriani tassels. This will force a cross with the Abenaki pollen which is all that will be available. Save the seed from this cross and plant it the next year but this time, plant 200 to 400 Floriani plants and at least 100 of the Floriani X Abenaki. Again detassel the Floriani and let the hybrid plants produce all of the available pollen. At this point, you have produced a hybrid and backcrossed it so the concentration of Floriani genes is 75% of the population. Grow the corn for 6 more generations and each time select for the traits you want to emphasize. You should get segregation for earliness, productivity, and eating quality. Dar, How do I know to de-tassel the Florianni vs. the Abenaki? How do I apply this knowledge to future projects? Ack! DarJones |
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Post by reed on Jul 20, 2015 18:11:22 GMT -5
Can't believe I just now found this thread, it came up in a google search. That's how I found the forum to begin with too. Looks like I got some catch up reading to do.
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Post by cornhusker007 on Aug 22, 2015 14:53:54 GMT -5
I had a thought today. In pumpkin breeding some of the giant record holders use sib breeding instead of inbreeding. Bred to a sibling from the same parent. Is this ever done in corn breeding? Also how is sib breeding different from a stable open pollinated corn?
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Aug 23, 2015 16:14:17 GMT -5
Saving the seeds from a single cob of corn, (or a single fruit), and planting them together in a group is a powerful way to quickly develop a variety, and to readily discern the strengths and weaknesses of each family.
Pollination is a highly localized event (quadratic in nature, so a little distance greatly dilutes crossing rates). In my garden, most of the time, most corn pollen falls approximately straight down. More or less. So a corn plant tends to mostly pollinate itself and a bit of the cob on either side. So when I plant my corn rows as sibling groups, I am doing a lot of sibling crosses, even though I didn't intentionally plan to be doing it. The same thing could be done with squash. Plant a sibling group together in the same hill, and space the hills apart a bit, and the sibling groups would mostly be inter-crossing within themselves.
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Post by reed on Aug 24, 2015 5:23:20 GMT -5
I have that going on right now, mostly just as a learning exercise. I planted seed from three ears of Painted Mountain Corn that were pollinated by sweet in blocks next to each other. I don't know how yet to do the calculations for what % of sweet or what arrangement of genes they might have so I will mostly just select by observation any shrunken kernels I might get. Joseph Lofthouse and DarJones explained it for me in another thread alanbishop.proboards.com/thread/8486/expect-flour-sweet so when the ears star to dry down I will have some reference as to what I'm looking at. I have had a problem with a worm that chews mostly on the new leaves, I'v never seen it before but I never planted corn in late July before either. I'm not doing anything about it other than picking them off by hand, there aren't a lot of them. |
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Aug 26, 2015 11:02:22 GMT -5
I tend not to like painted mountain corn. They are early, but super short in my climate. Too short. Plus they are flour corns. I don't like flour corns. Early flint corns are my preferred type.
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Post by reed on Aug 26, 2015 12:05:23 GMT -5
I got my PM from Sustainable Seed Co. I don't know maybe it was crossed up or something but it had a wide range. Some not much more that 3 feet tall some closer to 6. It all matured pretty much the same, I saved seed from the taller ones mostly. Soil was all pretty evenly fertilized with little difference in drainage and the like. The ones with purple stalks, although I liked the look were kinda weak and lodged more. Had similar height variation in some other kinds too and similar lodging with purple stalks. Sigh, if only I had more space and could grow a bigger population to select from.
What are some some good short season flints?
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Post by DarJones on Aug 27, 2015 0:01:49 GMT -5
Roy's Abenaki Calais Flint a version of which is available from Fedco.
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Aug 27, 2015 0:12:30 GMT -5
I've wanted to get some Saskatchewan Rainbow Flint for awhile now. Or something extremely similar. But heritage harvest seed only ships to Canada now. Maybe at some point one of my friends in Canada land can help me get some. Anyone know of anything that resembles the corn in their picture?
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Post by keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) on Aug 27, 2015 0:20:01 GMT -5
As Dar has pointed out though, most corn lines that have purple pigmented foliage often are linked with what i'm going to call the shrunken cob gene. In homozygous individuals this manifests itself as a smaller cob with more husks, and as a result is not able to be pollinated very well and does not produce many seeds. I have heard reports from some who have lines that do not have linkage to this genetic drawback, but i would assume they are rare at this point. I didn't grow much corn this year. Barely any at all. But i have two stalks that have deep purple foliage, and they each have a large normal looking cob. They do not appear to have the "shrunken cob gene" i have observed in my older purple ones. I will keep an eye on these. |
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If anyone is interested, send me a message. 
The long-eared Piricinco from Loreto is my favorite breed of maize. It is a low-yielding race but a great source of resistance to fungal pathogens and viruses, with some collections rivaling the levels found in the excellent Caribbean materials used by tropical breeders.
