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Post by synergy on Nov 25, 2010 4:40:12 GMT -5
Fascinating
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Post by silverseeds on Nov 25, 2010 13:35:08 GMT -5
Yes it is fascinating. what more fascinating, is we can do this in eco systems all over the place. add to them without taking away. Personally Id include non native plants as well. the static world view many currently have doesnt mirror reality. The earth is and always has been changing.
what we consider "normal" for a specific region now, is completely arbitrary. But thats another topic.
even using only native plants we can readily enhance and secure eco system, in various ways.
In the oceans for instance, we could seed corals, or build artificial reefs, enabling much more fish life in areas that otherwise would be more lacking in that regard. setting up convenient spawning areas, and other things....
It really can go as far as we want to take it. in fact we could make forests of the deserts, if we wanted, and took enough time to do it. In fact it looks like humans have donw this before. We know weve created deserts where once there was forest as well....
then there is areas like mine, once a vast forest covering several states, that has died slowly and "naturally" for a long time, humans greatly sped this up, to the point it has decades to live. We can not only halt its decline, but reverse it. It is our duty in my mind o do so.
I think it is humanities role. I see a world where each organism has a niche. I see mankind niche as being stewards. And I dont say this simply because of the bible or any other religios texts. although I do find that fascinating. The niche we appear to fill i the overall scheme of things implies to me, that when humans are connected, they grow in such a way that spread bounty. when we are separated (inside spiritually/energetically) we leave jagged trails in our wakes.....
Probably should of added that last part in there, but why not.....
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Post by Alan on Nov 30, 2010 23:09:36 GMT -5
Yes it is fascinating. what more fascinating, is we can do this in eco systems all over the place. add to them without taking away. Personally Id include non native plants as well. the static world view many currently have doesnt mirror reality. The earth is and always has been changing. what we consider "normal" for a specific region now, is completely arbitrary. But thats another topic. even using only native plants we can readily enhance and secure eco system, in various ways. In the oceans for instance, we could seed corals, or build artificial reefs, enabling much more fish life in areas that otherwise would be more lacking in that regard. setting up convenient spawning areas, and other things.... It really can go as far as we want to take it. in fact we could make forests of the deserts, if we wanted, and took enough time to do it. In fact it looks like humans have donw this before. We know weve created deserts where once there was forest as well.... then there is areas like mine, once a vast forest covering several states, that has died slowly and "naturally" for a long time, humans greatly sped this up, to the point it has decades to live. We can not only halt its decline, but reverse it. It is our duty in my mind o do so. I think it is humanities role. I see a world where each organism has a niche. I see mankind niche as being stewards. And I dont say this simply because of the bible or any other religios texts. although I do find that fascinating. The niche we appear to fill i the overall scheme of things implies to me, that when humans are connected, they grow in such a way that spread bounty. when we are separated (inside spiritually/energetically) we leave jagged trails in our wakes..... Probably should of added that last part in there, but why not..... I agree, there are a ton of things we could and probably should do, but those in power over this world aren't going to let it happen anytime soon as it takes the power out of their hands and puts it in the hands of capable free thinking human beings that can make a difference. An excellent example, starting at the very basist level, would be planting 10-20% of parks, rest stops, and public lands to edible fruit trees, shrubs, and gardens, fostering miniature eco systems to feed humans and animals alike. The boom in animals pays off to humans as well in the form of hunting overpopulated types and there is an abundance of food that can be collected by weary travelers, poor folks, and charities from the plants, unfortunately rules and regulations, red tape and beurocrats, business men and politicians and in general every manner of asshole alive make this simple thought impossible. Unless we are "Subversive" (spreading the truth, seperating the lies) and do this on our own without the overburdened beurocratic bullshit weighing us down, using green vandilism methods (seed balls, night time planting, reclaiming vacant lots) it won't happen in our lifetimes. Some say money is the root of all evil, but for those that have all the money in the world, power is the root of all evil. We can easily live without money if we choose to inform ourselves about what the earth can/could/has supplied past/future/present, and some of us see it clearly, but we will always have to fight against power hungry tyrants to do so. Now is the time, even if you can only do it in the empty lot next door to your urban house, in your back yard in the suburbs, in the side yard of the trailer court, in the abandoned farm fields in the country or on your own farm, work on your piece of the puzzle, others will follow, and when the money stops flowing (and it will) others will follow your lead. I too have a firm idea in my head that indeed we have engineered many climate zones on earth. I don't believe the whole Amazon or even a majority of the Amazon was terraformed, but I do believe that large masses of land in the Amazon were terraformed and the tiny tropical islands spread into a huge landmass naturally over time. |
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Post by flowerpower on Dec 1, 2010 6:32:32 GMT -5
My friend has lived in the same trailer park since 1985. Her new lease says no compost piles & no vegetable gardens. She got a compost maker, no problem. But no way is she getting rid of the veggie garden.
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Post by mnjrutherford on Dec 1, 2010 8:27:17 GMT -5
Some say money is the root of all evil, but for those that have all the money in the world, power is the root of all evil. We can easily live without money if we choose to inform ourselves about what the earth can/could/has supplied past/future/present, and some of us see it clearly, but we will always have to fight against power hungry tyrants to do so. Now is the time, even if you can only do it in the empty lot next door to your urban house, in your back yard in the suburbs, in the side yard of the trailer court, in the abandoned farm fields in the country or on your own farm, work on your piece of the puzzle, others will follow, and when the money stops flowing (and it will) others will follow your lead. I've been pondering this myself of late... Think of this... If money IS the root of all evil, then food IS the root of all power. How would it be possible for a single "entity" either human or human group TRULY be omnipotent? The only way I can imagine would be for all the rest of humanity to be completely ignorant. I'll be committing green vandalism over the winter by taking all the grape, blackberry, peach, and other trimmings and poking them into the dirt along the forest line. If they take off in the next couple of years, I'll start working on local ditches. |
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Post by plantsnobin on Dec 1, 2010 9:29:22 GMT -5
Not trying to be a downer here, so stay with me for a minute. If you are talking about sticking all those things on your property, fine. But lets think about planting stuff along a ditch line that you don't control. Around here, every once in a while county crews will go along the country roads with that sideways cutter that shreds trees. Maybe they don't do that everywhere. But if they do, there is little point in planting something that will only get cut down. And if your area doesn't cut them down, do you have deer? I am sure people would appreciate trees being planted that are going to bring deer to the edge of the road. Again, maybe deer aren't a problem where you live, but here I personally know 2 people who have been killed by deer coming through the windshield after the car in front of them hit the deer. Now, I understand that it is a current fad with the guerilla gardening, seed balls and all. But I can't help but think that there might be a better way. I know there are obstacles of course, but how about starting on your own place, build up your stock of proven varieties, really learn your stuff so you can teach others, then approach nursing homes, park boards, school boards, homeless shelters, etc, about helping them? Once you know what you are doing, you can offer plants to people who are interested in starting their own gardens. Just seems to me that planting on property that you don't control is akin to farting in the wind. I do plan to grow some persimmon and pawpaw trees for the little park close to me, but I will talk to them before I plant, to make sure that they don't have any plans to clear that area. It would be terrible to put all that time into growing the trees, planting them and then see them cut down. And I would probably shoot anyone I caught planting blackberries anywhere near me. Well, with rock salt anyway. Again, not trying to be a pain here, just saying we should think through what we do to try to get the best benefit from it. That might mean creating our own paradise and letting others know how they can create theirs too.
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Post by mnjrutherford on Dec 1, 2010 10:03:15 GMT -5
Not trying to be a downer here, so stay with me for a minute. If you are talking about sticking all those things on your property, fine. But lets think about planting stuff along a ditch line that you don't control. Around here, every once in a while county crews will go along the country roads with that sideways cutter that shreds trees. Maybe they don't do that everywhere. But if they do, there is little point in planting something that will only get cut down. And if your area doesn't cut them down, do you have deer? I am sure people would appreciate trees being planted that are going to bring deer to the edge of the road. Again, maybe deer aren't a problem where you live, but here I personally know 2 people who have been killed by deer coming through the windshield after the car in front of them hit the deer. Now, I understand that it is a current fad with the guerilla gardening, seed balls and all. But I can't help but think that there might be a better way. I know there are obstacles of course, but how about starting on your own place, build up your stock of proven varieties, really learn your stuff so you can teach others, then approach nursing homes, park boards, school boards, homeless shelters, etc, about helping them? Once you know what you are doing, you can offer plants to people who are interested in starting their own gardens. Just seems to me that planting on property that you don't control is akin to farting in the wind. I do plan to grow some persimmon and pawpaw trees for the little park close to me, but I will talk to them before I plant, to make sure that they don't have any plans to clear that area. It would be terrible to put all that time into growing the trees, planting them and then see them cut down. And I would probably shoot anyone I caught planting blackberries anywhere near me. Well, with rock salt anyway. Again, not trying to be a pain here, just saying we should think through what we do to try to get the best benefit from it. That might mean creating our own paradise and letting others know how they can create theirs too. Well, considering that I was talking about the 150' of forest line and 400' of ditch that are on my property which is 3/10 of a mile off the main road.... And yea, our neighbors are very interested in enticing all the deer we can get around here... So, I suppose I have been giving this a little thought... maybe? |
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Dec 1, 2010 13:10:44 GMT -5
Since before I was born, my family has been eating food that was planted by unauthorized gardeners. When the canals were dug around here someone planted the apple seeds from their lunchbag. Other people planted the smaller ditch banks to asparagus. 6 generation of my family have enjoyed the fruits of their labor. Nobody has been harmed by the planting, and many have benefited.
I continue the tradition. The only thing new about planting things in the commons is the name "guerrilla gardening".
For what it's worth, I can't bring myself to believe that a county is capable of owning a roadway or a park. And I can't bring myself to be upset if someone destroys things I have planted in the commons. Some of the things I have planted are thriving decades later, and others didn't last a month.
This fall someone made a comment about the beautiful flowers along a section of road behind an ugly industrial area thirty miles from my home. I just smiled because that was my first experiment with seed balls.
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Post by mnjrutherford on Dec 1, 2010 13:28:37 GMT -5
So just exactly what is a seed ball? Or rather, how do you make one?
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Dec 1, 2010 13:58:51 GMT -5
So just exactly what is a seed ball? Or rather, how do you make one? Throw some seeds in a bowl. (1 part) Add some compost. (1 part) Add some (red/brown) clay. (3 parts) Mix and add enough water to make it stick together well. Then form it into marble sized clumps and let it dry. I like pressing the dough through a wire mesh. It makes forming the balls much easier. You can throw the balls (even while driving), or shoot them from a slingshot. |
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Post by plantsnobin on Dec 1, 2010 14:01:33 GMT -5
I knew that would be taken wrong, didn't mean any offense. I know I come across all wrong when I am typing things out. Truly sorry.
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Post by mnjrutherford on Dec 1, 2010 17:05:59 GMT -5
Way cool! I like that idea! I've always notioned throwing tomato seeds out the window as I drove places... Thank Joseph!
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Post by mnjrutherford on Dec 1, 2010 17:06:58 GMT -5
I knew that would be taken wrong, didn't mean any offense. I know I come across all wrong when I am typing things out. Truly sorry. Thanks Karen. I'm sorry I got upset. Forgive me? |
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Post by Alan on Dec 1, 2010 18:56:15 GMT -5
Terra forming is much more then simply seeding desirable plants. but that works in many areas..... Id love to see our nations forest, rivers and oceans and back yards terraformed, to better feed mankind, and the animals. Many different ways to do this. In my case here in new mexico, altering the landscape somewhat, offers me the ability to grow a vastly wider range of plants. While also better supporting the water tables, which have been depleted heavily here. Potentials end where we stop looking. I agree that terraforming is much more than seeding plants, I've done more than a fair amount of research on the subject since I first brought it up on this forum and my blog a couple of years ago in the form of Terra Pretta. Theres no reason to preach to the choir about it. All each of us can do is our own little part in the whole thing, you as well as anyone should know and understand the obstacles that stand in the way of taking it to the next step. |
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Post by pierre on Dec 2, 2010 15:31:07 GMT -5
Look at: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terra_pretaTerra preta is from heavy charcoal addition as well as anything available. The secret is in the charcoal made from adjacent forests. A native's long lost recipe. Microorganisms development are consequence of higher biologic potential allowed by charcoal. And yes it is amazing that it remain fertile abandonned for centuries. |
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