Walking Onions, Catawissa? Red Top? Tree Onions?

[richardw]

Dec 31, 2012 0:34:28 GMT -5 templeton said:

Richard, they look like Kelly Winterton's potato onions (google him) - particularly with the flower scape on yours extending from the bottom of the clump, rather than from the middle of the bulb, which is what all mine do.

They do look similar
I think back 15-20 years nearly all mine grew there scapes from the middle of the onion also but because i don't like that trait i selected the ones that grew from the bottom of the clump,these days the number of clumps that have there scapes growing from middle of the onion is low,maybe about 10-20%

Dec 31, 2012 0:34:28 GMT -5 templeton said:

I've noticed the biggest bulbils I've ever seen on mine this christmas - not sure if this is because I've left them sitting in the one spot for a few seasons (since they are so easy to grow, they are often moved around into spare beds as i do my rotations).
Or on reflection, it might be because i removed bulbils to try and induce flowering (which has produced some seeds by the way). less bulbils, more energy per bulbil. Perhaps you guys growing them commercially could get a jump by going round and picking out all but one bulbil per cluster to induce bigger starts? Worth a try? Or too much trouble?

yes i reckon that would be a good experiment too,too late in the season to do it now but next year..opps this year i'll try it and see what happens

Dec 31, 2012 0:34:28 GMT -5 templeton said:

On the seed front, I've got 4 seeds from one seed head, and have bagged another half dozen or so.

T

The discussions within this thread about seed from tree onions has made me more aware of seeing if my line does in fact have seed or not,i always thought it didnt and that maybe its because i pull all the clumps out every year in Feb,so would i need to leave them in the ground a bit longer so as to give the onion more time to develop the seed??,this again i will experiment with but not in the bed of tree onions i have ATM as its a pain in the bum to have a few plants left in a bed when i want to prepare the whole bed (compost added&dug over) for bulbil replanting ,i'll set up a second experimental bed in Feb-March of which half can be used for the bulbil removal experiment.
Another thing ive been thinking about also was the mutant red onion,some thought that maybe it had crossed with the tree onion,but now i realize that the two flower at different times,the California Red Onion is flowering now but the flowers on the tree onions don't form till Feb ,so there's no way there could have been any crossing

[templeton]

Richard, as you were wondering about seed set on multiyear plants, I've noticed one or two small onion bulbs forming at the base of some of my clumps that I've left alone. Maybe I shift em too much.

I've also done the rounds of my bagged flowers - from over a dozen de-bulbiled and bagged inflorescences I've harvest 3 seed. Hopefully I won't kill them.
T

[richardw]

Jan 21, 2013 16:19:27 GMT -5 templeton said:

Richard, as you were wondering about seed set on multiyear plants, I've noticed one or two small onion bulbs forming at the base of some of my clumps that I've left alone. Maybe I shift em too much.

Can you get some photos of them T,just not sure what you mean.
Ive been studying the flowers on mine over the last two weeks and ive seen not a bee,fly or any bug for that matter been attracted to them yet there's still heaps bubble bees on the last of the California Red onion flowers

Jan 21, 2013 16:19:27 GMT -5 templeton said:

I've also done the rounds of my bagged flowers - from over a dozen de-bulbiled and bagged inflorescences I've harvest 3 seed. Hopefully I won't kill them.
T

I'm sure you wont kill them............surly??

Here's how mine are looking as of today,this bed will be pulled in a months time.

[templeton]

sorry for not getting back to you Richard.
I was wrong - mine set scapes from the bottom of the bulbs like yours and Kelly's - oops, not very observant of me!

Here's today's pics of the topsets.
(btw, how do you get multiple attachments per post?)
First, a pic of one clump pulled up and dissected.
Note senesced scape on right, multiple levels of bulbil clumps, newer scape also emerging from bottom of clump, and small bulb at base. However, the small bulb is already putting out new top growth, with the tops not really dried down, which always happens with mine.

Attachments:

[templeton]

The bed.

Attachments:

[templeton]

A further clump, again showing the position of scapes and the resprouting new bulbs.

Attachments:

[templeton]

Some of the topset bulbils

Attachments:

[templeton]

Pic - separated bulbs, and bulbils.

Since I had these interplanted with bunching onions, there was quite a bit insect activity around the flowers but given the flower bunches were small, most of the activity was concentrated around the big globe heads on the bunchings. I never get anything as big as the width of a stubby. Nice work.
T

Attachments:

[Leenstar]

Templeton- Do you dig you walking onions every year? Do you replant the topsets? I have been replanting my in new beds for the past three years but my version doesn't form those nice bib blubs like yours does. My stem with the topset is closely adhered to the bulbs that form and share a tight outer skin. How did you select that out on a what I would take to be a vegetative reproduction.

I'd love it if my walking onions could look like yours

[templeton]

Leenstar,
Do you dig you walking onions every year?
My husbandry is mostly neglect. They don't get much water in summer, or fertiliser at any time, a bit of top dressing with compost if they are lucky. I haven't paid close attention to how long I've left them in this bed - I usually move them, to make room for other crops, but these i think have been unmoved for a couple of years, since they ended up at one end of my perennial bed, and I'm a bit lazy.
Do you replant the topsets?
I do replant topsets, and get nice bunches of bunching onions in autumn, winter and spring, and I give lots away. But sometimes I just leave them.
but my version doesn't form those nice bib blubs like yours does...
This is the first year I've really noticed any bulbs at the base of the clusters, but as I noted above, they sprout almost as soon as they form, even without much watering - I want nice bib blubs like Richard's!

My stem with the topset is closely adhered to the bulbs that form and share a tight outer skin.
Mine too, until they dry off and senesce. I haven't done any selection at all, apart from just replanting what survives. But they are bloody difficult to kill. And vegetative selection is as you point out probably and exercise in hope, more than anything else - unless you get a vegetative mutation as Carol Deppe describes for her topset onions in 'Breed Your Own Vegetable Varieties'. Thus my interest in seeing if i can get some viable seed off them. Raymondo was kind enough to forward me a bit of new material to work with, that with luck will provide a bit of diversity if I can get them to flower again next year.

I'd love it if my walking onions could look like yours
Awww, shucks...
T

[richardw]

Thanks for posting the photos T,gees that bed is chocker block full onions do you get as much of the red colouring in the your bulbils as mine?

[raymondo]

Just planted out a dozen or so bulbils for winter green onions. Most had reddish tinges when the golden skins came off. The bulbils were all small, around pea size I guess. I will have to be more observant in future and start selecting bigger bulbils to see if I can get them up to your size Richard!
Among last season's lot, from which the bulbils I just planted came, one lone plant set seed. It's still ripening so I don't know if the seed is viable or not. I sent the bulbils from this plant to T as he's already got a breeding population.

[richardw]

Keep working working at it Ray,remembering i started off with tiny little bulbils once too.

[richardw]

Harvested my tree onions today,i was really pleased and reckon its best crop ive ever had certainly for size,i also cleared the bed they came out of,dug in compost and replanted the bulbils from the best clumps.

[raymondo]

They're a good size Richard. I'd be more than happy to get bulbs that size.