Looks like oca does need cold

[rowan]

6 weeks ago I started an experiment to see if it takes just daylength or does cold come into play to force oca tuberisation. It was the start of summer and I picked two well grown plants of two varieties to try this on.
I covered the plants with a frame and carpet so they only got 7 hours of light per day for two weeks then covered them completely, only checking the soil moisture occasionally.

After a week or so of total darkness both the plants were showing light stress with yellowing leaves and extended shoots and after three weeks both plants are dead with no sign of any tuberisation on the stems or roots.

Damn, I was hoping that they would only respond to day length, then I could cheat and string out a harvest for months, covering one bed at a time. Oh well, now I know that they need cold on them also.

[richardw]

Could building some kind of refrigeration box over them work

[blackox]

I think I've read something about using a pot with moist sand in it somewhere as a cheap refrigeration system, I'll see if I can find it again.

[copse]

Dec 29, 2013 9:59:56 GMT -5 blackox said:

I think I've read something about using a pot with moist sand in it somewhere as a cheap refrigeration system, I'll see if I can find it again.

If I recall correctly, you need to put a damp cloth over the top, which may or may not be problematic.  This may be what you are referring to: wikipedia.

[steev]

Sweet! That would SO work on the farm.

[blackox]

You've got it Copse! I'm sure this can be adapted in some way.

Maybe used to clay pipes instead of pots to leave the bottom open to go over the oca. And then a lighter type of cloth can be used to let some of that sun shine through. The cloth shouldn't be too much of a problem, it's sunny down under, isn't it?

Yup, Steev, this will enable you to keep a secret stash of wine in the chicken coop.

[Deleted]

My first attempt didn't make it here, in good condition, but we do have a native Oxalis, which creates bulbils.

I'm assuming that conditions are right, here, and hope to be able to crossbreed.

[steev]

Degzing: I hope you aren't referring to the "sour-grass" oxalis that is a horrid weed, here in California.

Blackox: I don't need to stash in the out-house, but I've known guys who searched for out-houses, because great-grandpa would stash his bottle there and drop it down the hole when it was empty; some of those old whiskey bottles are quite valuable, besides which, if you dropped a coin (even a gold piece) down the hole, you weren't likely to go after it; lovely black soil down those shitters, these days.

Besides, if I had a chicken coop, I don't suppose the wind would be blowing through enough for this to work well, at least not if I wanted my chooks to be happy. No; I'd put it in the shade, north side of the pump-house, plenty of breeze there. Besides which, I rarely drink booze that isn't tasty at ambient temperature. Modern over-hopped American beer? Feh! Not fit for gopher-purge, until it's been processed.

[Deleted]

I had requested my tubers, too late after harvest. They had molded, on the way here. I still managed to get small plants out of them, but they weren't that sturdy. So, my project is still in the concept phase, unless these are able to establish themselves.

Of all the Oxalis relatives, yes, oca did look very similar to our 'Sour Grass.' Sour Grass does make bulbils, some of which look very slightly different in terms of size, shape, and color. I wondered whether these weeds could be developed for size, color, or lower acidity, over a few generations, or if they were compatible with Oca.

I watched a documentary about fur farms, in which animal coloration changed radically, within several generations of artificial breeding. Could a common weed be so domesticated, within a human lifespan?

Some people apparently mix different garden-varieties, until they arrive at one which does the best in their location.

To me, when I think of landraces, I consider the plant's wild relatives, especially because they are weedy. Corn supposedly benefits from teosinte. Foul and livestock are crossed with wild or feral versions of themselves for vigor.

In particular, the native variety of oxalis is successful, under our local periods of light. Does oca have comparable, biological rhythms, or can they be adjusted through breeding?

Also, are varieties with colored foliage compatible with the ones which make tubers. Would it be possible, someday, to tell the color of the roots by looking at the leaves?

[ottawagardener]

There is someone on the fb root forum who uses complete darkness to dramatically increase tuberization.

Oca crosses: I had wondered about the possibility. Keep us updated.

[Deleted]

I'm leery of using chems on anything meant to be eaten, but I understand that a plant's biological clock can be manipulated by using common hormones.

[copse]

Coming back to this using evaporation to cool plants where not enough cool weather is available, was talking to my neighbour down the road and round the corner. A hippy who sings for a living, and lives the permaculture and organic lifestyle. His brother in law got him onto using this, but not for growing.

His brother in law cut a hole in the top of a chilly bin, attached a metal plate inside covering the gap. Then he bolted and sealed a terracotta pot onto the metal plate sitting on top. To test it, he put it in his car for the day in the sun at around 40C inside, and at the end of the day hearsay has it that the beers inside were cool and frosty.

So practicality proven, neighbour uses a coolbox built using this approach for their fridge. I can't remember what set up he has though. This is the first time anyone I've met has actually used and vouched for this technique working.

[steev]

No question it works, just like sweating keeps us from dying in the heat somewhat. That's why there are no desert pigs; poor critters can't sweat.

It is theorized that we aren't furred because hairlessness allowed us to be cool enough to pursue furred prey through the heat of the day, until it was so heat-stressed and exhausted that we could get close enough to spear it.

When working in heat on the farm, I go rinse down my arms and face ~every hour; I dry on a towel in the pump-house, which is cross-ventilated; ~the half-hour, I go wipe my face with the towel, which is cold and refreshing from evaporation. I think it's better not to rinse more often so as not to lose quite so much oil, being uncomfortable with the whole sunscreen thing. I'll trust in my family's story of Native American blood, however diluted, and accept that if Our Father, the Sun, becomes my enemy, I will have overstayed my welcome.

[richardw]

Aug 26, 2014 23:39:31 GMT -5 steev said:

That's why there are no desert pigs; poor critters can't sweat.

Dont know about that,The Australian outback has heaps of pigs,but then they do have hair,

[steev]

Those have to be feral, not indigenous. I think the closest thing to a truly desert pig would be the Peccary, a fairly small swine-ish critter, found in the south-western parts of the USA. Pigs have been introduced nearly world-wide because humans find them tasty; since pigs are rather intelligent, they have often escaped bondage (and often been set free to be fruitful and multiply), often to the detriment of native species (who needs ground-dwelling birds when you can have bacon?).