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Post by kyredneck on Dec 1, 2014 9:34:02 GMT -5
...aka Gray Shallots, Grey Shallots, Griselle Shallots, “Echalotte Traditionnelle”.
Anyone on board grow these on a permanent basis? You know, are they a dependable 'subsistence crop' for the homestead? Fall planted, are they practical for a spring green onion? I'm seriously considering trying to obtain some and get them in the ground this year.
Would appreciate any info cultivation or culinary wise.
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Post by kyredneck on Dec 1, 2014 9:53:49 GMT -5
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Post by ilex on Dec 1, 2014 12:29:06 GMT -5
They are very small and fussy, not vigorous, and need some cold/cool weather.
There are better subsistence allium crops.
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Post by Walk on Dec 1, 2014 17:02:33 GMT -5
...aka Gray Shallots, Grey Shallots, Griselle Shallots, “Echalotte Traditionnelle”.
Anyone on board grow these on a permanent basis? You know, are they a dependable 'subsistence crop' for the homestead? Fall planted, are they practical for a spring green onion? I'm seriously considering trying to obtain some and get them in the ground this year.
Would appreciate any info cultivation or culinary wise.
Our "brown" "shallots" (Dutch yellow? or potato onions?) are a great subsistence crop as they keep extremely well. We're still using the 2013 harvest. But they don't do well in Minnesota if planted out in the fall. I put them out in very early spring, first week of April here. Don't know how they would do if fall planted farther south. Been growing them for many years and they never disappoint. |
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Post by kyredneck on Dec 1, 2014 19:33:32 GMT -5
"We're still using the 2013 harvest"
The red potato onions I once grew kept like that, amazing. Thanks for the info on Dutch Yellow shallots.
Probably if you mulched them you could fall plant and have earlier onions. Do you eat any as scallions?
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Post by kyredneck on Dec 1, 2014 19:41:02 GMT -5
They are very small and fussy, not vigorous, and need some cold/cool weather. There are better subsistence allium crops. Zactly what I was wanting to know, thanks. Sounds like Walk is growing a good 'subsistence allium'. |
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Post by ilex on Dec 2, 2014 3:13:41 GMT -5
Fall planted potato onions in warm climates do well. I' ve had nests over 3 pounds. The problem is they make mostly small bulbs. Planted in spring they make fewer, but bigger on average. Fall planting is the way to go to increase stock, spring for eating.
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Post by kyredneck on Dec 2, 2014 8:24:28 GMT -5
Thank you again ilex, I had no idea that spring-planted equaled fewer but bigger bulbs, and I have actually spring-planted some in the past, but failed to take note of or make the connection between any size differences. Whodathunk? Can you explain why that is so? This would explain why some gardeners do both, fall-plant some AND spring-plant the rest of their multipliers each season, I guess. If fall-planted equals more scallions come spring that suits me fine; it's those wonderful early green onions that my clan loves.
Fall-planted equals earlier (as in scallions in March, which is great!) has always been the logic with me. Some winters can be very mild here and the onions can actually take root and sprout through the cold months under the mulch and be ready to 'jump' come March. Also, there's a 'garden saying' in my locale (from the old timers growing potato onions no doubt), "Don't let a July rain hit your onions", because the typical hot & humid summers here steams/cooks/damages the outer layers of the bulbs to the point that they will rot instead of curing after harvest, thus the expediency of fall-planting at this locale.
[add]
Another question: would spring-planted potato onions be more tolerant of summer humid heat than fall-planted potato onions? |
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Post by Walk on Dec 2, 2014 14:10:46 GMT -5
Our "shallots" don't overwinter well even with mulch. For early green onions, we have perennial Egyptian or walking onions. They are extremely hardy. We've had the same variety for over 30 years. We also have some perennial Japanese bunching onions. They're also ready early in the year but they remain edible longer into the summer than the walking onions. Along with leeks (and chives and garlics), these alliums fill all our needs for onions throughout the year.
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Post by kyredneck on Dec 2, 2014 14:29:48 GMT -5
Years ago during his gardening prime Dad fall-planted the whole unbroken bulblet clusters from Egyptian onions solely for the early scallions. But you're right, the scallions get tough as the season progresses.
Per my second post, have you grown the perennial leek?
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Post by 12540dumont on Dec 2, 2014 14:49:56 GMT -5
We have perennial chives that give green onion flavor most of the year. I always plant some Evergreen Bunching for early scallions. We are onion crazy here. So I plant several varieties of onions in the spring as well. We have done both fall and spring planted shallots. I like the red ones best. Zebrune is an OP variety that I really like. When I get bulbs, I always store some in the barn and replant for seed in the spring. Leeks do well planted in the fall. Our gophers love perennial onions and have gotten into my most precious bulbs. Lots of times fall planted onions bolt if we get too much early spring heat.
Last year we had unseasonably warm weather very early. By May we had high 90's. When this happens, the overwintered onions make very small bulbs.
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Post by templeton on Dec 2, 2014 15:21:15 GMT -5
Per my second post, have you grown the perennial leek? Many (most?) leek varieties will form basal bulblets that turn into 'new' plants. Or chop them high leaving the basal plate in the ground and let them re-sprout. I'm mass crossing half a dozen varieties including perennial leeks this year, to see if i can get a bit of diversity going. Sorry, can't offer any advice that would be applicable to your location. T |
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Post by kyredneck on Dec 2, 2014 15:42:58 GMT -5
"chop them high leaving the basal plate in the ground and let them re-sprout"
It's my intention to dabble with that technique with the multiplier scallions next year, just to see what comes of it.
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Post by ilex on Dec 2, 2014 16:00:31 GMT -5
My theory is that each bulb has so many growing points, those are the bulbs you get on the first round. Each bulb grows, and if it gets enough resources, they divide again. When you plant early, you see big bulbs divide and become smaller ones. If you plant late, they don't have time to divide.
I don't think they will be more tolerant to heat. They bulb mostly based on daylengdivide I've planted as early as September.
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Post by ilex on Dec 2, 2014 16:08:00 GMT -5
Regarding leeks, many op varieties will resprout, or form bulbs, specially if they don' t flower. There are also many perennial ones propagated by bulbs ( like elephant). I'm very happy with "puerro de bulbo".
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