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Post by MikeH on Jun 5, 2016 7:16:33 GMT -5
Local swaps amoung friends are a bit different and far less dangerous, but cross country and international unmonitored exchanges are dangerous to all of us. I'm sure that plant pests and diseases are moved by swaps but unless the nasty is extremely virulent in reproducing or this is a great deal of swapping going on, the chances of international swapping being a significant vector would seem to be small. Global trade is a far more likely vector - link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs10530-007-9138-5. Document here. |
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Post by castanea on Jun 5, 2016 8:40:41 GMT -5
Global trade beats the crap out of whatever vector is in second place. Seed trading among folks like us is so far down on the list it is probably statistically insignificant.
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Post by templeton on Jun 5, 2016 18:35:41 GMT -5
I'm not sure that the situation in Australia is so similar to the US or EU. Biogeography would indicate that North America and Eur/asia were connected in relatively recent times, and probably share a lot of organisms. The more northern areas share the legacy of recent glaciation. On one view the ecosystems in these areas are dominated by post-glacial 'weeds'. The biological isolation of A&NZ and different conditions mean we have unique biota. These are seriously under threat from invading organisms, particularly 'weedy' species from The North. Any protection we can offer them is probably a good thing. This isolation is also a competitive advantage to our beleaugered farmers who also deserve some protection. I suspect there is considerable tension within our bureaucracies between the bioprotectionists versus the free traders, who want to remove all barriers including non-tarriff barriers like quarantine - see the long-standing debate about NZ apples, Australia, and fireblight-a dark day for NZ disease scientists.
In a previous occupation i worked in conservation- the heartbreak at seeing stuff go locally extinct for want of funds and political backbone spurred my vigilance in the areas where i could be effective - i was at times a draconian by-laws enforcer. Import law enforcement might be redtape-ism, but it might also be local workers, frustrated, well intentioned, trying to do their bit.
I'm generally not very patriotic, but in this case I think import restrictions into Aust are mostly a good thing. I agree that international trade is probably a greater risk, but my personal view is that restrictions on it should be way stronger, and better funded. Current import restrictions might be a feelgood but ineffective response to biosecurity, but at least it is something. You can keep your pea eneation virus, aster yellows, late blight strains, fireants, House Crows, weasels, and the like. And if you would like your foxes, rabbits, donkeys, camels, texas needlegrass, european wasps, sparrows and starlings back, feel free to come over and take them home with you.
While it can be a bit frustrating to not be able to get hold of some sexy new varety of vegetable, it doesn't endanger my livelyhood, and its not like there isn't a hundred other interesting things to get on with. And if I'm really interested in something, I can just stump up th cash for quarantine -tho my pockets are unlikely to be that deep.T
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Post by blueadzuki on Jun 5, 2016 20:03:11 GMT -5
Global trade beats the crap out of whatever vector is in second place. Seed trading among folks like us is so far down on the list it is probably statistically insignificant. Speaking from my own first hand findings, the food trade seems to be a significant contributor in that. For all of the odd variations of domestic crops I have found in the beans and spices of ethnic markets, there have been just as many seeds of bindweeds, kudzus, nightshades, etc. I have to assume that everything that comes in still meet whatever passes for the purity laws (or at least, they do when they are actually inspected. But as tech gets better, I assume that the rules will tighten and eventually all foods (and I mean all, as it becomes cheap enough to be feasible I fully expect spot checking will be replaced by universal "check absolutely everything, absolutely all the time" rules) to be required to either go through a version of the robot checking seed purity labs use (or a better one with actual robots who will look over everything seed by seed) which is probably the good option, or that everything sold for food be irradiated into sterility (the bad option as a lot of the junk stuff is slightly toxic, and irradiation won't do anything about that) And it's not like Australia is completely free of letting things slip out in exports either; I have a little bottle on my dresser with a drowned Eupoecila inscripta that hitched a ride over here in a load of frogs to show that (pity it wasn't still alive, it might have made a neat pet assuming it could have kept it fed (what do fiddler beetles eat anyway?) |
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Post by steev on Jun 5, 2016 21:20:26 GMT -5
Bureaucracy, the last refuge of incompetence.
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Post by philagardener on Jun 6, 2016 5:15:03 GMT -5
It probably never occurred to anyone that someone might plant food . . . no one would do that, would they?
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Post by blueadzuki on Jun 6, 2016 5:31:06 GMT -5
Well, I do, but I admit it is not a usual method (though quite a good one if you are trying to do some crops) I'd say the greater threat is people throwing unwanted food on their mulch piles, or on their lawns "for the birds". A LOT of people do that.
For the birds also reminds me of the fact that birdseed is pretty weedy too (though since most birdseed components are produced domestically the weeds tend to be ones that are already here). Most of the stuff that comes up is more volunteers of wheat, millet, sorghum and other things, which are no exactly weeds (in that they aren't all that hard to get rid of and the indicence of birds will usually mean they'll disappear or be controlled of their own accord). But a lot of birdseed also has quite a bit of things like Cocklebur in it which IS a major weed and a lot of birds can't get through the seedcoat of.(there was an American bird that loved cocklebur, the Carolina Parakeet, but we rendered it extinct in the early 20th century).
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Post by MikeH on Jun 6, 2016 6:28:44 GMT -5
The biological isolation of A&NZ and different conditions mean we have unique biota. I think that it goes a bit further than that to include islands in general. I know that Bermuda has an interesting set of biological immigrants, most of which are either cute or a minor aggravation except for one that fundamentally altered the island - environment.bm/bermuda-cedar/. It's replacement - environment.bm/casuarina/ is a true pest. Although the Bermuda Cedar is slowly making a comeback, eradicating whistling pines will be problematic at best. |
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Post by kazedwards on Jun 6, 2016 18:42:57 GMT -5
Going from the US to Australia/ New Zealand is one thing. Restrictions on that is under stood. The two places have very different ecosystems and species. Now Canada and the US is a different story. We share a continent. Anything we have disease wise they have and vice versa at least to a certain extent.
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Post by richardw on Jun 19, 2016 16:31:27 GMT -5
As the importation laws stands here in NZ an importer bringing in Chinese garlic is legally not allowed to grow it, but he/she can give it to someone else and they legally can, this is crazy. 15 years ago all Chinese garlic sold was labeled 'not to be grown' because its well known it carries viruses. . templeton you say ' see the long-standing debate about NZ apples, Australia, and fireblight-a dark day for NZ disease scientists.' 10-15 years ago it was alleged by a NZ scientist that fireblight was already in stralia and the regulation were nothing more than just protectionism |
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Post by templeton on Jun 19, 2016 19:07:25 GMT -5
richardw, The scientist in question visited the botanic gardens in melbourne, twice i think, and on the second visit, remarkably found fireblight on cotoneaster, which occurred in NZ, and not australia, being the reason that NZ apples were restricted imports to Oz. An international court case was running at the time to lift the ban. The whole area went into lock down, and a very expensive survey of every garden within several kilometres was undertaken, and the loss of irreplacable wild Rosaceae, and big specimen plants in the gardens, which were destroyed to prevent further spread. A similar experience took place in Adelaide, almost at the same time, again in the botanic gardens, and again, by a NZ scientist. No other fireblight was found anywhere, apart from where the two Kiwi scientists had found it. as far as i know, no mechanism for its sudden appearance at two public locations, 500 km apart was ever forthcoming. Curious...  Just don't start talking about underarm bowling...  T
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Post by richardw on Jun 19, 2016 23:36:25 GMT -5
One would think that it smells of biological espionage doesn't it, just remember though its going to take many generations to heal the scares resulting from that cruel underhanded bowl.
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Post by richardw on Jun 19, 2016 23:38:22 GMT -5
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Post by templeton on Jun 20, 2016 1:45:19 GMT -5
Almost handed my passport in after that one - a dog act - that you shouldn't forget! T |
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Post by richardw on Jun 20, 2016 15:43:57 GMT -5
Thirty five years later its still talked about, but hey, its enhanced the rivalry between us neighbours, at least that rivalry is always friendly unlike what we are seeing in Europe involving the football.
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