7.5 earthquake at midnight

[steev]

Note that along Hwy 1 in Big Sur there was an area, Devil's Slide, that blocked the road every few years, due to slippage; I think that's finally been dealt with, with a tunnel. The area inland from the highway is very mountainous, which led to a 4+ month wildfire in there this year.

I don't doubt that there are good reasons why things get built where and how they are, but so often it turns out to be the most immediately cost-effective, rather than the most long-term cost-effective. I get that it's difficult to get people to see that doing something for the long-term, while immediately more expensive, is cheaper in the long run.

I repeat: build it right; build it once!

The same works for our soil; make it irrelevant with chemical inputs, or work to improve it for the long haul. Build the understanding of our community; build our soil; build the resources of our community and progeny; improve our environment for ourselves and our heirs.

[reed]

There is a lot of conflicting info about the New Madrid. Wikipedia says there were four in 1811 - 1812 ranging from 7 to 8.6. The first written record of one was by a French missionary in 1699. It says there was a 6.4 in 1895, a 5.5 in 1968 and a 4.5 in 2008. It's coming but for the most part people around here just don't talk about it.

I suspect the one in 1968 is the one I remember most vividly. I was laying flat on my stomach on the floor playing a game of chess with my brother. It started with a funny noise then an even funnier sensation in my stomach and other places. Then the chess pieces all did funny little circular dances except for my queen who waltzed right off the board and fell over. After much excitement and discussion it was determined it was an earthquake. After further discussion I conceded that if your queen flees the battle due to an earthquake you have to finish the game without her. I still won.

[kazedwards]

Nov 24, 2016 4:09:55 GMT -5 steev said:

Note that along Hwy 1 in Big Sur there was an area, Devil's Slide, that blocked the road every few years, due to slippage; I think that's finally been dealt with, with a tunnel. The area inland from the highway is very mountainous, which led to a 4+ month wildfire in there this year.

I don't doubt that there are good reasons why things get built where and how they are, but so often it turns out to be the most immediately cost-effective, rather than the most long-term cost-effective. I get that it's difficult to get people to see that doing something for the long-term, while immediately more expensive, is cheaper in the long run.

I repeat: build it right; build it once!

The same works for our soil; make it irrelevant with chemical inputs, or work to improve it for the long haul. Build the understanding of our community; build our soil; build the resources of our community and progeny; improve our environment for ourselves and our heirs.

I agree with you steev. We could definitely build things smarter. I remember watching a video about water management in cali. The video basically said that if we planned out the infrastructure around proper water drainage then the water problem wouldn't be as bad. A lot of water gets wasted from storm drains and run off. Instead they could make smaller reservoirs that would fill during the rains and could be used during the dry season. They had it were it drain from roads in to a series of reservoirs. Each one was lower than the other and they were separated by sand berms (I'm guessing) to filter it from road waste. At the bottom of the last reservoir would be a field. There was also small canals leading the water farther away. I don't know how well it would actually work but was interesting still. Hopefully I didn't just hijack this thread. Sorry if I did!

[richardw]

Looking at the rock formation differences between Hwy 1 in Big Sur and the Kaikoura coast line i would think that Big Sur rock looks a lot more fragile. Even though the rock is much harder along the Kaikoura shore line it wasnt going to stand a chance against a fault rupture only just out to sea by a short distance.

[richardw]

Nov 24, 2016 9:31:38 GMT -5 reed said:

There is a lot of conflicting info about the New Madrid. Wikipedia says there were four in 1811 - 1812 ranging from 7 to 8.6. The first written record of one was by a French missionary in 1699. It says there was a 6.4 in 1895, a 5.5 in 1968 and a 4.5 in 2008. It's coming but for the most part people around here just don't talk about it.

Given that the New Madrid fault system is about 150-mile (240 km) long, yes i would agree that it capable of producing a 7 plus considering this is longer in length than the 6 fault lines that ruptured simultaneously here. Though often the great the time between ruptures the more energy that gets stored for when it does let go.

I suspect the one in 1968 is the one I remember most vividly. I was laying flat on my stomach on the floor playing a game of chess with my brother. It started with a funny noise then an even funnier sensation in my stomach and other places. Then the chess pieces all did funny little circular dances except for my queen who waltzed right off the board and fell over. After much excitement and discussion it was determined it was an earthquake. After further discussion I conceded that if your queen flees the battle due to an earthquake you have to finish the game without her. I still won.

Thats quite funny, must have been an older was he seeing you couldn't get your own way.

 

[nathanp]

Regarding the New Madrid fault, there have been significant earthquakes approximately every 450 years.

the size and spatial distributions of historic and sand blows that formed about 1450 A.D. and 900 A.D. were determined to be strikingly similar to each other, suggesting that the prehistoric earthquakes had similar locations and magnitudes to the 1811-1812 earthquakes. Furthermore, sand blows attributed to the 1450 A.D., 900 A.D., and 2350 B.C. earthquakes are composed of multiple, fining upward layers similar in thickness to those that formed in 1811-1812. These observations support the interpretation that the prehistoric events were similar in location and magnitude to the 1811-1812 earthquakes and also suggests that they too were earthquake sequences.

USGS New Madrid

pdf link 2003 HUD

There is also a great deal of evidence that suggests that the Mississippian mountbuilder cultures essentially were destroyed by New Madrid earthquakes, probably by the one around 1450/1470 AD.

There likely were more frequent 'minor' ones under the level considered by these studies.

I'm also curious what the impact of fracking will be on the area. I can't imagine it will be anything good.

[reed]

I did a little more reading and found there is another large seismic zone north of the New Madrid called the Wabash Valley seismic zone.

"According to the United States Geological Survey, lesser earthquakes occur relatively frequently, but those at a magnitude of less than 3.5 or so are usually not felt. Ones strong enough to be felt usually happen once or twice a year, and those large enough to cause moderate damage have occurred every decade or so. Quakes in this region can be felt in a much wider range than those in other zones such as California.[3] ... "The strongest earthquakes in the last few years have come from the Wabash Valley Fault..."

The one that damaged the Washington Monument in 2011 was centered in Virginia, that's outside of Wabash and New Madrid both. Sounds like the whole of eastern North America hops around now and then. How the crap going on in Oklahoma from the fracking might effect it all has crossed my mind too.

richardw, yep it was my older brother but my dad actually settled the argument, if your queen gets hysterical and faints there is nothing you can do about it. We laughed about that earthquake and chess game till the day he died. 

[blueadzuki]

Hmm, when one of those hits, people must think their houses are being shelled. Kinda gives a new meaning to "Wabash Cannonball"

[richardw]

Its a really weird feeling when you and your house are being rocked wildly, afterwards, even years after when you recall those moments there a feeling thats so hard to describe. Its like having that strong nurturing instinct kick in when your child injured or extremely unwell, i found myself with those same feelings when the timber framing of the house was making a lot of straining noises, like its in pain.

[nathanp]

The sad part about the area surrounding much of the New Madrid fault is that so much construction is built of brick. Including a great deal of housing in the cities. Those are not places you will want to be in when a big one hits.

[richardw]

nathanp Is that brick exterior with internal timber framing

[nathanp]

I believe it is predominantly brick without timber frame, built to save money.

link

[shoshannah]

interesting that in 1811 and 1450 there were also comets.  The 1450 had a impact in the water off New Zealand.  450 year cycles suggests comet activity is involved.

[richardw]

Nov 27, 2016 21:52:55 GMT -5 nathanp said:

I believe it is predominantly brick without timber frame, built to save money.

link

Interesting that it took a fire to change over from building with wood. How far is St Louis from fault lines

In 1849, the steamboat White Cloud caught fire and drifted onto the riverfront wharves; a third of the city was destroyed in the subsequent blaze. A hurriedly-passed local ordinance forbade the construction of wooden buildings, and St. Louis became even more predominantly brick.

[richardw]

When i was with my first wife, we owned a house that was built in 1890, its walls were solid concrete and round river rock, even though the walls were over half a metre thick,it had no internal timber framing,  i used to go to bed at night thinking, 'please, dont let there be The Big One tonight'. Thankfully i managed to escaped the marriage and that scary house with my life, she wanted me to buy her half out, stuff that!!, didnt want to stay in that bloody house, 1992 we sold it to a Ford dealership who went on to knock the house down and built a workshop/car sale yard. I'm sure that house would have come down in the 2010 7.1 Canterbury earthquake.