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Post by atash on Mar 22, 2010 17:12:09 GMT -5
Interesting thread. Tom Wagner and I have had a few conversations about L. hirsutum x L. esculentum hybrids.
I've grown L. hirsutum. It might tolerate brief overnight frosts in a dry climate, but nothing extended and it doesn't like damp, cold weather.
What I am more interested in than a tomato that could overwinter, is one that is simply cooler-growing. I mean, whose biochemistry is optimized for temperatures more like the ambient temperatures typical of my climate's growing season. The cultivated tomato prefers temperatures a bit warmer than typical of my summers--especially at night. There are tomatoes bred for this climate, but all their adaptations, such as being parthenocarpic, or determinate, or having short pistil tubes, or whatever, don't really address the fundamental issue of temperature compatibility.
I think it would be great, too, if tomato plants were just a bit tougher. I have other members of the family in my garden that grow like weeds and naturalize abundantly. Maybe crossing domesticated tomatoes with wild tomatoes would improve their vigor.
Tim, we have friends in common. FWIW I happen to be growing one of your tomatoes this year.
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Post by canadamike on Mar 22, 2010 17:21:34 GMT -5
Atash, I was once told PRUDEN'S PURPLE was good for the cool PNW. It sure could withstand the really cold and damp summers we have had in the last years...
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Post by littleminnie on Aug 31, 2010 16:09:32 GMT -5
I don't get it. Why are the cucurbit species (moshata, maxima, pepo) not interbreedable but the chili species (annuum, chinesis, frutescens) are interbreedable? I had figured they weren't. And I was thinking since Bhut Jolokia is a weird unique specie it wouldn't cross-pollinate with anything. Last year I saved seeds from a Thai pepper (annuum) and a Laotian pepper (frutescens) without isolating. There probably weren't many insects on my deck but the peppers came true this year regardless. So why can't I save my habs without isolation if they are the only chinensis? What a bugger.
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Post by atash on Aug 31, 2010 21:53:23 GMT -5
Actually, they are interbreedable--within limits. Not every combination works, and you get reduced fertility. That's why you use C. moschata as the "bridge species" between maxima and pepo. You'll often here that species are defined by breeding barriers, but that's not true. It's actually "2 significant" differences in the flowers or fruit, but "significant" is arbitrary, and in any case some plants breed across genera. Thanks to the lumper fanatics at Oxford, there are now bogus "species" that include plants that WON'T cross because of different chromosome counts. As a matter of principle I ignore those lumpings. It's a unique variety, but not a species. Bhut jolokia is itself a hybrid, mostly Capsicum chinensis (a misnomer; Capsicums aren't really Chinese) but has some C. fructescens genes too. It is suspected of being an accidental hybrid at that. So, sometimes something interesting comes from accidental crosses.  |
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Post by blueadzuki on Sept 1, 2010 16:33:56 GMT -5
If I was to define any chile as being "uncrossable" I'd probably pick something like Rocoto and its fellow C. pubescens And even that is really unbreedable, it's just that it's hard to cross with most of the other conventional chiles; most of the other Capsicumn species it will readily cross with are either true "wild peppers" or varities that really aren't grown much by anyone save the true capsicum species fanatic. |
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Post by DarJones on Sept 5, 2010 16:12:40 GMT -5
Several years ago, we built a faq on gardenweb showing which peppers will cross and which will not. It is worth looking over. faq.gardenweb.com/faq/lists/pepper/2003044441005626.htmlMore often that 'sometimes' in my experience. I have several tomato selections that came out of accidents in my garden. It works out to about 1 in 3 of my bee made hybrids that turns out special. For example, I have Tastiheart which came from an accidental cross of Large Pink Bulgarian with an unknown heart. There is still a lot of work involved in stabilizing a selection out of a cross. As an interesting aside, I had Tastiheart plants that survived 22 degrees a couple of years ago. All other tomatoes were wiped out and most of the Tastihearts were killed except about a dozen plants that were totally unharmed. DarJones |
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Post by DarJones on Oct 9, 2018 21:02:13 GMT -5
I should have contributed this info a couple of years ago. Perhaps it will still be useful.
Including Solanum lycopersicum, there are currently 13 species recognized in Solanum section Lycopersicon. Three of these species—S. cheesmaniae, S. galapagense, and S. pimpinellifolium—are fully and bidirectionally cross compatible with domestic tomato. Four more species—S. chmielewskii, S. habrochaites, S. neorickii, and S. pennelli—can be readily crossed with domestic tomato, with some limitations usually successful only in one direction. Five species—S. arcanum, S. chilense, S. corneliomulleri, S. huaylasense, and S. peruvianum—can be crossed with domestic tomato with difficulty and usually require embryo rescue to produce viable plants. The Lycopersicon section has not been fully sampled within wild species in the South American range, so new species may be added in the future.
Solanum section Lycopersicoides and section Juglandifolium are represented by two species each that are considered bridge species genetically intermediate between tomato and non-tuber bearing potato species. S. lycopersicoides can be crossed with domestic tomato and introgression lines have been developed. This species was significant in moving the domestic tomato from separate genus status into the Solanum group because it directly links the tomato into the potato family.
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