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Post by canadamike on Jun 6, 2009 3:24:15 GMT -5
Here are a couple of pictures of true shallots. The queen of all shallots is said to be the grey frog leg shallot. Orflo just sent me bulbs of a variety called Klimt and says it is the best he ever has. They are very small, about a small radish size. Whatever has a yellow skin in NOT a shallot, but an onion of the same sub group ( aggregata), whatever the name. They are a culinary cosmos away from true shallots. They are to true shallots what Ugly Betty is to Salma Hayek in the good looks department...    They are diced extremely fine:  An average looking one  The french grey shallot, the most prized of them all. Hard to find. Richter's used to sell it. You don't want to know the price... The ''grey'' relates to the pale violet of the flesh, which looks greyish, especially once diced.  If you have never tasted them, grow them. At 3$ for a minuscule 250 grams bag (half a pound) for the cheapest ones, they are worth growing. Just grow lots of them, as you will end up frustrated very fast if you grow just a few. They are not the most productive vegetable. |
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Post by mnjrutherford on Jun 6, 2009 8:09:58 GMT -5
Val and Pat... ok, I don't owe you anything. I will learn seed saving! Speaking of which, 5 of the pines have sprouted and the Hartman's are the biggest tomato plants thus far. Though one has a fungus which is presenting itself as "freckles" on 2 or 3 bracts. I'm treating it with daconil but would like to know if there is a better way. You guys are great!
Michel, I know what you are speaking of flavor wise. This becomes most apparent at Thanksgiving when I make turkey gravy. The difference between using shallot and onion was shocking the first time I used shallot. The richness and depth of flavor was like the difference between standing at the mouth of a cave peering into the darkness and standing in the main cavern open mouthed as you sunlight dancing across the crystalline structures sprouting from the surfaces.
It is also the difference between eating store bought white "bread" and my homemade sandwich bread. In my bread I toast a pinch of saffron in the bottom of a pot then add milk which is allowed to come to a scald then removed from the heat, covered, and allowed to rest till the following day. The flavor of the saffron is not obvious, but the color of the bread slice is so appealingly golden, the aroma brings to mind fresh butter, and the flavor is... well... WONDERFUL! I can hardly wait till the day when I make it with eggs from my own chickens and milk and butter from my own cow as well as that tiny but oh so perfect pinch of toasted saffron.
I will bow to your experience and knowledge with the shallot Michel and to Martin's with the walking onions. Both play an important part of true cuisine and I want both in my gardens!
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Post by mnjrutherford on Jun 6, 2009 8:18:05 GMT -5
Michel, checked your link and they do not have the leg of Poitou available at the moment. YES! very interesting stuffs. I'll have to discover if they ship to America.
Do you have anything to say with regard to perigord?
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Post by PatrickW on Jun 6, 2009 8:21:30 GMT -5
Daconil, I thought you were giving up chemicals?
It's probably early blight. As bad as the name sounds, if this is what it is, it's often not too serious. Like all foliage diseases, the best way to start is remove the infected parts of the plants to slow the spread. If you have early blight, you probably won't get rid of it completely, but you can slow the spread considerably.
If you want to give up the chemicals you have to stop using them eventually!
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Post by mnjrutherford on Jun 6, 2009 13:20:11 GMT -5
Yea, I know. But Jeff said that was what it would take and I'm so panicked about the tomatoes I bought first and thought later. On the other hand, what kind of fungicide could I use? Maybe rub a little baking powder on the affected areas? Mike puts Gold Bond on his feet. ;D
Seriously though, there must be some sort of safe fungicide. No vinegar...
If I remove the bad parts, that's a good half of the plant. Think it will recover? It's actually spreading pretty fast.
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Post by canadamike on Jun 6, 2009 13:38:41 GMT -5
Sulfur is considered organic and should probably do the trick.
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Post by PatrickW on Jun 6, 2009 13:57:35 GMT -5
My advice would still be to just remove the foliage. Fungal infections are difficult to control with anything under any circumstances, organic or otherwise, and can spread quickly. Your best bet is to simply remove it from your garden. I don't believe daconil or sulphur or anything else offers you a better chance of saving your plant, it will only waste your money. Anytime you use anything in your garden regardless of it's organic you also risk causing other problems.
It happens sometimes that you have to give up one plant to save others, but in this case I don't think pinching off half a tomato plant will kill it, and it will grow back.
Farmers who use chemicals to control fungal diseases generally have to use them before their plants become infected or they don't work. The same is probably true in your garden, and the best way to prevent infection is with good hygiene.
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Post by grungy on Jun 6, 2009 17:13:57 GMT -5
Jo, can you take a cutting above the effected area and root it?
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Post by mnjrutherford on Jun 6, 2009 19:57:55 GMT -5
hmmmm.... Well, I went into this season prepared to sacrafice all the tomatoes. ::sigh:: I think I'll take both advices. I can cut off the top removing all the fungus and see what happens to the bottom. Then, the tip top that is still clear I'll treat with some willow tea and put it in a pot. This year is all experiment anyway right?  Thank you for being so encouraging. I really appreciate it. |
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Post by grungy on Jun 6, 2009 22:53:47 GMT -5
Say, Jo, where do you think we get all these ideas from? A little hint - most of us have been there and tried these things out personally and in a lot of cases, several times. Best of luck.
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Post by robertb on Jun 7, 2009 4:05:23 GMT -5
I think you use 'shallot' to mean the same thing that I do, but it's worth checking. I'm planning to build a raised bed or two over the summer (I have the planks and the soil, it's just a matter of finding the time and the energy), and hopefully that'll start to improve matters. If I get more overwintering onions surviving that alone will show it's working!
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Post by PatrickW on Jun 7, 2009 4:41:58 GMT -5
Good luck Jo. Let us know how it goes.
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Post by mnjrutherford on Jun 7, 2009 9:45:36 GMT -5
Val, you are SO right! I have been so focused on past failures I lost sight of the fact that I'm here and asking advice for that very reason! Please, forgive me. I will succeed with my tomatoes this year no matter what!  I will happily employ your recommendations, analyze and report results and know that at seasons end, I will be a better and more successful gardener/farmer for having done so. Thanks for the cool water in my face Val and for not letting me get off track.  Robert, I agree, I believe we are on the same page with the shallots. The variety I have had most experience with look like the one in the second photo from the bottom of Michel's post. Easy to come by back in California, non-existent here in North Carolina. Well, I have a tomato to coddle. I'll report back with photos a bit later. |
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Post by grungy on Jun 7, 2009 11:03:11 GMT -5
Nothing to forgive. Best of luck on your gardening/farming and keep on asking. After all life is a learning process and the only "dumb" question is the one not asked. My grandparents lived into their 90's and all of them said that a day that you didn't help someone, and learn something new was a day wasted. (Possibly the reason that I appear to be "nosy". I don't want to waste one day.)
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Post by paquebot on Jun 7, 2009 23:08:57 GMT -5
Mike: You do have a way with words, and that does sound really tasty! Robert: Don't feel too bad if you are confused with the term shallot, there are lots of different words used to describe nearly or exactly the same onion. Potato onions, nesting onions, shallots and multiplier onions all refer to more or less the same thing, and I suspect different terms are more popular in different parts of North America. A good example is potato onions and shallots. Few chefs would be interested in yellow potato onions but would quickly welcome golden shallots into their kitchens. They are the same thing! Martin |
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Thank you for being so encouraging. I really appreciate it.
I will happily employ your recommendations, analyze and report results and know that at seasons end, I will be a better and more successful gardener/farmer for having done so. Thanks for the cool water in my face Val and for not letting me get off track. 
