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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Sept 28, 2015 21:29:41 GMT -5
Here's what my medium maxima fruits looked like that I am saving for seeds. I'm selecting for texture, taste, and skin similar to banana squash (or more specifically similar to an F1 hybrid between banana and hubbard. About 2/3 of these fruits are descended from a banana crossed with hubbard with other influenes), so some of these may end up being eliminated from the gene pool before planting next spring if they are too dry or too hard. I'm aiming for about 15 pound fruits. Most of the fruits that I eliminated this year were for being too small. A couple were too large. Some were too long season. I'm only keeping seeds from about 1/4 of the fruits that were produced. I suppose that I'll add about 5% of seeds from the Hopi Cross project. Just to keep the genetics a little bit on the unpredictable side of things.  Here's what some of the culls looked like:  The Hopi Cross fruits that I set aside for saving seeds from look like this:  The buttercup squash that I am saving for seed look like this. They are my favorite tasting squash. I eat them with lots of oil because they are so dry: Either sauteed in coconut oil, or baked in slices in the oven in a cake pan heavy with oil, or baked with the addition of lots of butter. Productivity is low, but I forgive because they taste so great. I grow these in a separate field from the other maxima squash so that they stay true to type. I'd like to increase the productivity of this variety... Therefore last growing season I made a cross between it and what I've been calling 'Hopi White' (looks like a sweet meat). I intend to grow that out next year and reselect for the buttercup taste and shape, and perhaps find some genetics that add to productivity. There were a couple of off-type fruits in the patch this year. Taste was the classic buttercup taste, but they were Kabocha shaped, and seed color was tan instead of white like the buttercups. I saved those seeds separate, and intend to replant some small percentage of them inside the buttercup patch. I'd hate to get stuck in a rut of only trying one thing at a time to improve a variety.  |
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Post by jondear on Sept 28, 2015 22:52:53 GMT -5
Pretty squash Joseph!
I've read an article by Brent Loy and he basically says as productivity goes up, dry matter goes down. I guess there's only so much produced per plant to go around.
We peel and boil our kabocha squash until fork tender. As I drain the water off, if I lose a lot of color and starch, I deduct points for that squash. Color that pleases me when it is mashed gets points, but taste and texture get the lions share of whether or not seed gets saved.
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Post by notonari on Sept 29, 2015 2:51:15 GMT -5
Agreed, very beautiful squash, particularly those buttercups.
I should try your method of adding lots of fat, I like my squash dry but some of the driest are not very good for baking just like that.
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Post by mattiemeg on Nov 29, 2015 15:46:48 GMT -5
hi Joseph, it's a delight to see the variation in your maximas. Do you think there is significant difference in taste/ dry matter in orange/red vs. green maximas? The orange varieties I've grown (Golden Nugget, Uchiki Kuri, Victor, rouge vif d'etampes) have always been disappointing (wetter, less sweet) compared with the greens (dryer, sweeter: bush buttercup, Marina, kabocha); whereas the blues are somewhere in between (blue hubbard, guatemalan blue, crown prince). Of course these comparisons are made across different cultivars and so not really valid. I wonder if your orange buttercups are as good as their green siblings? I would like to grow an orange/ red maxima which is worth growing for its taste and not just its looks!
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Nov 29, 2015 19:23:31 GMT -5
mattiemeg: Welcome to the forum. I'll intend to cook a green and an orange buttercup side by side in the next few days and see if I can discern a difference in taste. People keep asking me about that, I suppose I aught to come up with a definitive answer. Most of my maximas are still waiting to be cooked, so I could do a number of taste comparisons. I tend to really like the taste of F1 or F2 hybrids between wildly different types of maximas, for example Hubbard X Banana really pleases me. Sweet Meat X Buttercup is another hybrid that I enjoy.
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Post by steve1 on Nov 30, 2015 6:07:09 GMT -5
Love all the maximas, must admit I had little idea of the real diversity available. Here's my maxima, it's a cross between Turks Turban and Australian Butter. Flesh is like Australian Butter not at all like the stringy Turk's. It has golden juvenile fruit that ripen to apricot. However it has no powdery mildew resistance at all which caused a very short (still got a few) season last year. Anyone know of any varieties with PM resistance? dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/94877168/TurkishButterJuv.jpgdl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/94877168/TurkishButter.jpgCheers Steve |
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Post by philagardener on Nov 30, 2015 6:45:46 GMT -5
Pretty squash, steve1! Is this out of the F1 or have you stabilized the line? I have poor luck with maximas because the squash vine borer is a serious problem for me. A diluted milk spray can be useful treatment for powdery mildew. www.sciencenews.org/blog/food-thought/dairy-solution-mildew-woes recommends 15 gm powdered milk per liter of water to control powdery mildew on grapes (in Australia, no less :>)) |
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Post by steve1 on Nov 30, 2015 15:31:17 GMT -5
Thanks Philagardener, this one was a F5 so pretty stable now. Fair to say being on the other side of the world (isolation) has it's advantages - particularly when it comes to less bugs and diseases.
Thanks for the tip, but I have used the milk spray on F2 peas, but am keen not to have to go there as long as I grow squash... Big plants = lots of time.
I found a free Hort Science Journal review article on Pumpkin and Squash genes (2005). If it's of interest I'll post the link.
Cheers
Steve
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Post by diane on Nov 30, 2015 16:05:55 GMT -5
yes, please
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Post by steve1 on Dec 1, 2015 2:51:00 GMT -5
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Post by mattiemeg on Dec 9, 2015 15:41:01 GMT -5
Thanks Joseph. Interesting point about F1 and F2s from diverse parentage tasting better. A couple of years back I grew some F1s (mother was buttercup but father either Crown Prince or blue hubbard): they were medium large, grey-green with lighter green stripes with no 'button' and were delicious. I have since not experimented further with crosses but perhaps I will follow your lead in 2016. Meanwhile, I'm looking forward to the results of your orange vs. green taste test!
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Post by notonari on Jul 31, 2016 7:26:02 GMT -5
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Post by jondear on Jul 31, 2016 16:17:16 GMT -5
Nice squash! (And blog)... A couple of them look as big as basketballs!
I'll bet that yellow striped one will be turning bright orange soon. I ended up with another orange squash among my squash again this year as well. My source for orange skin came from "Sunshine", but so far, none have compared to the taste and texture of the original f1. Maybe you'll have better luck than I did.
This year I sowed seeds from just three good tasting, well storing fruits. There still seems to be plenty of diversity due to the the number of bee's working last year's crop. I can definitely see a Hokkori cross in one plant. They are much smaller and more abundant. Time will tell if any seeds make it into next years planting.
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Post by notonari on Aug 1, 2016 2:39:48 GMT -5
Hadn't heard of Hokkori, interesting, from the description I found it seems to be a bit more productive than Sweet Mama.
Yeah some are really big, so I'll have to be a bit harsh in my selection this year. Sounds like it might be a good idea to select from only a few fruits in the beginning, and then to widen the selection pool later on as the most undesirable traits are weeded out.
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Sept 12, 2016 21:42:38 GMT -5
keen101 (Biolumo / Andrew B.) : Here is a progress report on the maxima squash seed that I grew for you this year... This is the first time that I have planted squash in the field that I used for this grow-out. None of the squash varieties I planted thrived in the field. That included pepo squash, my landrace moschata squash, and my landrace mixta/moschata segregating hybrids. Oops. Better luck next time. The next nearest maxima squash was about 135 feet away with a building, fence, trees, and hedges surrounding the field in which these were grown. "These were Dr. Coynes segregating populatios that had been selfed. These were the first lines from the original Indian Squash (IS) seed received from the family who had saved the seed from relatives at Ft. Robinson. (I recommend soaking seed overnight before planting; it has been stored in controlled seed storage since 1984. IS-84-1-3: Mottled Elongated. Selfed. IS-84-2-1: Green Elongated. Selfed." I planted about 20 seeds of each variety: 5 seeds of Mottled Elongated sprouted. They grew very poorly, and have not set fruit yet. They might have released some pollen. We've already had our first fall frost. I have 12 seeds left to try again. 4 Seeds of Green Elongated sprouted. They grew better. Still poorly, but well enough to flower and make some fruits. Here's some photos of the fruits. There are two seeds left. Photos are clickable for a high resolution version...    
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