andyb
gardener
Posts: 179
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Post by andyb on Aug 9, 2018 0:05:39 GMT -5
I should probably request some seed for it and see if I can introgress those compatibility genes into a runner bean... Interested in joining efforts? I aim at white flowered runner beans to have in the crosses. If you are fine with it, I'm happy to share any successful cross. Do you know any source of ICA pijao seeds? Best, Srdjan I looked around and don't see them anywhere but from the US seed bank, ARS-GRIN. Is there a European equivalent you can request from? I'm also not sure if there's a way you can request from the US seed bank internationally. I'm sure CIAT has some, but there would be a bunch of paperwork and I'm not sure they would distribute seeds to an amateur. I'm not comfortable with sending or receiving seeds internationally through normal mail or by otherwise circumventing import/export restrictions, but I would love to collaborate with you on strategies, techniques and results! |
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Post by imgrimmer on Aug 9, 2018 2:00:50 GMT -5
I looked around and don't see them anywhere but from the US seed bank, ARS-GRIN. Is there a European equivalent you can request from? Maybe IPK Gatersleben german genebank. But Evaluation of accessions is almost absent. You never know what you will get... |
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Post by walt on Aug 9, 2018 14:20:31 GMT -5
I think requesting from GRIN is worth a try. I know they send seeds to professionals nearly anywhere. It costs nothing to fill out the online forms and make the request.
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Post by walt on Aug 9, 2018 14:33:24 GMT -5
Wouldn`t it be a good idea to incorporate the outcrossing bean accession to this project? (I just can`t remember where I read about it, someone here might know) I think so. Srdjn has it, and I have it. But I'm not in this group. YET. But it looks like a lot of fun. Next year? I expect to have plenty of the outcrossing beans when harvest starts. |
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Aug 9, 2018 21:22:44 GMT -5
The last few days, I have been attempting manual pollinations of the [common X runner] bean crosses. Some bush beans are flowering nearby, so that's what I'm using. There are also pole bean flowers nearby, but I'll use bush bean pollen preferentially.
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andyb
gardener
Posts: 179
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Post by andyb on Aug 9, 2018 22:42:40 GMT -5
The last few days, I have been attempting manual pollinations of the [common X runner] bean crosses. Some bush beans are flowering nearby, so that's what I'm using. There are also pole bean flowers nearby, but I'll use bush bean pollen preferentially. For that backcross, with emasculation, I get one pod for about every 5 crosses. Most pods only have one seed but a few have two. |
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andyb
gardener
Posts: 179
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Post by andyb on Aug 9, 2018 22:48:41 GMT -5
But I'm not in this group. YET. But it looks like a lot of fun. Next year? I have some more projects lined up, hoping to kick them off this winter depending on how some crosses/growouts go. I also still have quite a few common x runner seeds in my inventory. I'll try to remember to PM you when the time comes, but send me a note if you haven't heard from me when planting season is near. |
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Post by Joseph Lofthouse on Aug 9, 2018 23:29:47 GMT -5
For that backcross, with emasculation, I get one pod for about every 5 crosses. Most pods only have one seed but a few have two. I'm not emasculating. Just adding pollen to whatever natural pollination might be going on. If I can remember, I'll drag some runner bean pollen in from a different field. Is there any point in attempting a wider cross? I also have flowers from tepary, lima, and cowpea. |
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andyb
gardener
Posts: 179
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Post by andyb on Aug 9, 2018 23:56:45 GMT -5
I'm not emasculating. Just adding pollen to whatever natural pollination might be going on. If I can remember, I'll drag some runner bean pollen in from a different field. Is there any point in attempting a wider cross? I also have flowers from tepary, lima, and cowpea. Yeah. There's really no reason for you to do emasculations if you're just trying to get more seeds and get some bush bean genetics in the population, and fertile x fertile bean crosses are pretty easy. I wouldn't say that there's not a point in attempting a wider cross, but I wouldn't get your hopes up. I attempted about 130 (common x runner) x tepary crosses without success, and that should be by far the easiest of the three you mention. Then again, I haven't attempted those crosses with those particular combinations of varieties and I haven't attempted any crosses with lima beans or cowpeas. Maybe your environmental conditions are the magical combination. Who knows? |
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Post by Srdjan Gavrilovic on Aug 10, 2018 5:25:12 GMT -5
Interested in joining efforts? I aim at white flowered runner beans to have in the crosses. If you are fine with it, I'm happy to share any successful cross. Do you know any source of ICA pijao seeds? Best, Srdjan I looked around and don't see them anywhere but from the US seed bank, ARS-GRIN. Is there a European equivalent you can request from? I'm also not sure if there's a way you can request from the US seed bank internationally. I'm sure CIAT has some, but there would be a bunch of paperwork and I'm not sure they would distribute seeds to an amateur. I'm not comfortable with sending or receiving seeds internationally through normal mail or by otherwise circumventing import/export restrictions, but I would love to collaborate with you on strategies, techniques and results! GRIN is the only place I found them as well. In general, I try to find other sources and try not to disturb seed banks but when there is no alternative then choice is simple  They do ship internationally. In general, cleaned seeds, are not problem for local legislation. Endangered or invasive and all locally important species (e.g. pine seeds) are big No, No. Due to climate, very few "elsewhere commonly grown" species are having agricultural significance here and are not regulated. Yeeeee, lucky me, I can import seeds from so many species just to watch them fail completely  Information exchange is always welcome. Unfortunately, my attempts to grow Phaseolus sp. failed completely few years in row and especially regarding results, I have very little to show. This year is an exception, due to unusual worm season (read spring temperatures for many), I finally got some seeds. I have at least 1 seed from each of 50+ combinations of hand cross-pollinated P.coccineus (all emasculated flowers). In 2 years, I hope to have something to show |
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Post by raymondo on Aug 10, 2018 17:22:42 GMT -5
Great thread. Really enjoying it. Might have another go at hand pollinating a common x common cross. Tried once years ago but I don’t have a delicate touch and managed only to mangle flowers I tried to emasculate. Those coiling stamens make it difficult. Thought I might try a fertile x fertile cross and just keep my fingers crossed.
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Post by reed on Aug 10, 2018 21:23:06 GMT -5
andyb, did you by chance use some greasy beans in your crosses?
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andyb
gardener
Posts: 179
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Post by andyb on Aug 11, 2018 0:03:38 GMT -5
andyb , did you by chance use some greasy beans in your crosses? Sure did. Both your white greasy bean and one of your brown greasy beans that was crossed-up with something else. I sent you at least one seed of each, hopefully more. My record keeping when I was sending seeds out wasn't very good. |
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Post by reed on Aug 11, 2018 5:01:01 GMT -5
Well that explains the slick, shiny pods forming on one of the vines. They are not normal greasy beans, too wide and flat.
Did I send you any wild beans, phaseolus poylatacious? The tiny little pods shatter easily and takes lots to make much but they truly are perennial, my patch is three or four years old and just keeps getting bigger both from roots and self seeding. I haven't actually eaten any but they would certainly make an interesting cross. hint, hint.
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andyb
gardener
Posts: 179
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Post by andyb on Aug 11, 2018 13:32:33 GMT -5
Well that explains the slick, shiny pods forming on one of the vines. They are not normal greasy beans, too wide and flat. Did I send you any wild beans, phaseolus poylatacious? The tiny little pods shatter easily and takes lots to make much but they truly are perennial, my patch is three or four years old and just keeps getting bigger both from roots and self seeding. I haven't actually eaten any but they would certainly make an interesting cross. hint, hint. Well, that's cool. I guess the "greasy" trait is dominant. It'll be fun seeing where those end up in a few years. You did send me some P. polystachios and I have one plant growing under lights in the basement. It hasn't flowered yet, but is getting big enough that it's starting to dominate the grow area. The photoperiod is set at 16 hours of light per day, and I think I'm going to drop it to see if I can trigger flowering. Along with the P. polystachios, I currently have runner beans, tepary beans, and the one mixed-up runner x common plant with runner bean cytoplasm. I'll try crosses back and forth with them all if I get flowers from the P. polystachios. Where did you get the seeds for the P. Polystachios? |
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