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Post by raymondo on Nov 15, 2010 23:51:06 GMT -5
Interesting. I'm working on a gold Cylindra (Golden x Cylindra) and have some F2 going to seed at the moment. Not happy with the root shape yet but I can cross it back to Cylindra if need be.
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Post by flowerpower on Nov 16, 2010 7:41:44 GMT -5
Jo, I'll give you one. But you have to pick it up in Cooperstown.  |
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Post by galina on Dec 12, 2010 7:12:24 GMT -5
There are some beans which seem to never settle down while giving different colors than what was planted. I have one which is officially a tricolor but will produce 4 different. If black beans are planted, the results are black, white, brown, or black and brown. If white are planted, it's white and brown. If brown are planted, it's either black and brown or brown. It all eventually comes back to black.
Martin[/quote]
I have been given a bean with the working name of 'tricolour' from a Dutch seed saver, and the original beans had a very colourful intricate seed coat. These never settle down either and I have grown them for several generations here. Interestingly, they have all long, beautiful snap beans, which can be green, light green, purple or striped, and their seeds are all different. Plain black ones can come back as multi coloured pinto types on beige background, or dark blue, or olive brown or anything else, but the basic seed shape is large, in line with their large pods. It has always fascinated me why this bean cannot settle down into just one phenotype.
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Post by paquebot on Dec 19, 2010 0:13:29 GMT -5
I have been given a bean with the working name of 'tricolour' from a Dutch seed saver, and the original beans had a very colourful intricate seed coat. These never settle down either and I have grown them for several generations here. Interestingly, they have all long, beautiful snap beans, which can be green, light green, purple or striped, and their seeds are all different. Plain black ones can come back as multi coloured pinto types on beige background, or dark blue, or olive brown or anything else, but the basic seed shape is large, in line with their large pods. It has always fascinated me why this bean cannot settle down into just one phenotype. I may have one almost exactly like that. Large pinto type and what surprised me last year were the number of bluish seeds. When they were planted back this year, they returned several shades of blue as well as light and dark brown and some light buff with black specks. I'd like to lock in the blue as it's an unusual color for a bean. An interesting thing about the original stock was that one side of the bean would have specks while the other side had swirls. Martin |
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Post by galina on Dec 21, 2010 6:24:23 GMT -5
Martin I hope you can eventually lock in the blue because it sounds most attractive. If the bean variety will let you ... Before the colours get too dull in storage I have just looked at my variable bean again and taken a few photos: First picture shows the different types I got this year: Attachments:
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Post by galina on Dec 21, 2010 6:30:41 GMT -5
Then I had a surprise. Looking again at the reddish seeds on the bottom right hand side, I noticed that one of them also had a spotted side and a swirl on the other. I had not noticed that before reading your post. Here is the spotted side: Attachments:
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Post by galina on Dec 21, 2010 6:39:10 GMT -5
I am sorry these pictures are not great. The light is bad and my old digital camera is not that good at close-ups, but I hope you can see what I mean when you click to see the picture full size. Apologies that it is a bit fuzzy. Last photo shows the same group of 4 reddish beans, this time the other aspect with the swirl. Same bean. Attachments:
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Post by paquebot on Dec 21, 2010 22:42:03 GMT -5
You inadvertently put up the same photos but now you know what I'm talking about with Uncle Steve's. When there are markings, it's spots on one side and swirls on the other.
Should be able to lock in the blue. For those, what was planted this year was blue with markings. Most of what were harvested had no markings and two shades of blue. The other half of that 15' trellis was planted with unmarked brown seed. They resulted in mostly the same as were planted. I'll be planting back the blue and the light buff with markings next year.
Martin
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Post by mnjrutherford on Dec 22, 2010 7:00:40 GMT -5
Jo, I'll give you one. But you have to pick it up in Cooperstown. DEAL! |
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Post by galina on Dec 22, 2010 8:01:42 GMT -5
You inadvertently put up the same photos but now you know what I'm talking about with Uncle Steve's. When there are markings, it's spots on one side and swirls on the other. Should be able to lock in the blue. For those, what was planted this year was blue with markings. Most of what were harvested had no markings and two shades of blue. The other half of that 15' trellis was planted with unmarked brown seed. They resulted in mostly the same as were planted. I'll be planting back the blue and the light buff with markings next year. Martin Martin, the 3 photos are all different, and the text hopefully explains what to look for. No inadvertent mistake. I understand that a l l your original Uncle Steve seeds were spotted on one side and had a swirl on the other. When I started to notice both sides ,following on from your post, I found o n e seed in the red group that fitted that description. I wish I had the space to devote a larger area to bean experiments. This year I also had to find space for the first half of the F3 grow-out of a very interesting accidental cross between Indiana Banana x Berner Landfrauen bean. Pale yellow early bean x late green podded with purple speckles, they could not be more different. The diversity in the grow-out is just breath taking. Next year the second half and then a decision which strains to follow up further. I ended up with a 'forest' of mini wigwams, dotted around and filling every available space between other crops. I will be very interested to hear how your blue and light buff with markings will turn out next year. |
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Post by paquebot on Dec 22, 2010 19:58:28 GMT -5
The one bean in question was the one which I didn't look close at!
It is correct that most Uncle Steve's started out with the same spot and swirl combination. I also think that the original were all about the same color. When planted, they resulted in what I sorted out as light or dark brown. When those were planted back, one resulted in a lot more plain brown than speckled. The other resulted in either normal brown or blue-green, both with spots and swirls. When the plain brown was planted this year, nearly everything resulted in the same except for what was apparently just one plant with the light buff with markings. The blue-green returned both dark and light blue plain plus some steel gray with with markings. At the moment, I only plan to plant the plain blue and the buff marked next year.
Martin
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Post by davida on Dec 7, 2011 0:30:33 GMT -5
Martin and Galina,
Found this thread while reading about beans. Would both of you be kind enough to reopen this thread and give us the results for 2011? For Martin, the Uncle Steve's blue and buff marked bean results. And for Galina, the F3 results of the Indiana Banana x Berner Landfrauen bean cross. Both sound extremely beautiful and interesting.
David
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Post by davida on Dec 7, 2011 8:31:44 GMT -5
Martin and Galina, Found this thread while reading about beans. Would both of you be kind enough to reopen this thread and give us the results for 2011? For Martin, the Uncle Steve's blue and buff marked bean results. And for Galina, the F3 results of the Indiana Banana x Berner Landfrauen bean cross. Both sound extremely beautiful and interesting. David Of course, we would like to hear of everyone's interesting experiences with bean crosses in 2011 and unstable bean varieties. There is some interesting information on this thread that I would enjoy seeing updated for 2011 growing season. Thanks, David |
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Post by littleminnie on Dec 7, 2011 19:51:10 GMT -5
This is an interesting old thread. Everyone always denegs the idea that beans and peas cross so in 2010 I saved rattlesnake pole and provider bush. They were separated by like 20 feet on average. The rattlesnake seed came pure and I have been selecting it to be more purple. The provider seeds which I now planted some of in 2011 come crossed. They were not bushy but not pole and they were flat and crescent shaped and not as productive as provider usually is. So as I planted the provider this spring and summer, I mixed the purchased and saved seed some evidently (thought I would magically remember what I seeded where and why) so within a row it would have sections of true provider and sections of curled and vinier green flat pods. They tasted much better than true provider, which I don't prefer the taste of.
Anyway this first experience of saving 2 beans not completely isolated made me timid of trying again. You read it will be ok and then you get funky stuff. So what should I know?
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Post by raymondo on Feb 16, 2012 23:08:54 GMT -5
I tried to do a bean cross between Slenderwax (yellow podded bush) and Amethyst (purple podded bush). Boy is it fiddly with the intertwined pistil and stamens. I broke flower stalks, squashed bits and generally made a right mess of things. I managed to isolate one lone stigma without any obvious damage but couldn't find any pollen so I stuck a stigma from an opened flower onto it. I'll persevere with the current attempts but I don't think bean crossing is my thing. Hands just too big and clumsy and eyesight not nearly god enough.
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