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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 3, 2011 18:52:09 GMT -5
Hi, I've been looking everywhere for these beans. They are not at GRINS Seeds of Diversity, Seed Savers Exchange Southern Seed Savers Exchange No on-line catalogs (really, I've spent hours searching every one I can think of) Anyone, this is a plea to find these beans. If anyone even has 20 seeds they can part with, I would so much appreciate it. If anyone sees these in a catalog or seed list shoot me an e-mail. I'll send you a thank you bouquet of sunflower seeds. Holly & Leo Attachments:
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Post by mjc on Feb 3, 2011 21:16:25 GMT -5
Any of the ones on the list or a specific one?
Are they all supposed to be Phaseolus vulgaris? Some other Phaseolus? Even Phaseolus at all?
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Post by happyskunk on Feb 5, 2011 0:43:29 GMT -5
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 16, 2011 19:49:24 GMT -5
I found most of these beans by digging around into what the Italians have actually identified as rare landrace beans. Beans that will disappear. I have found a farmer in Sicily who has the two Badda Beans, I have the Lamon in hand, I'm waiting for the Purgatorio and Zolfino to arrive in the mail. I can't use gourmet shops to buy beans. There's no guarantee to the germination, how old the beans are, whether they were grown in isolation or are all crossed up. Happy Skunk, the last link in your e-mail, I read their paper. That's where I began. I even wrote to her to try and get connected with the seeds. No luck. I'm waiting for my USDA permit to be approved to be able to import these directly from Italy. But to import them, I have to find them! I'm working on a trial. Many of these beans are higher in protein, zinc, and iron than your ordinary pinto. I have hopes of being able to grow them out and send them out to seed savers to conserve. Anyone out there growing these in your back yard? On your farm? I will pay for the shipping, exchange seed, etc. If you're looking at the attached snapshot, note I'm only working on the Fagiolo. They have a lot of other crops they are trying to save. Attachments:
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 16, 2011 19:52:40 GMT -5
One more thing, one of the beans on this is a ceci bean (garbanzo). Okay, so I can skip that one  |
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Post by happyskunk on Feb 16, 2011 21:45:21 GMT -5
I do not think cross pollination would be a problem. These from the gourmet shops were likely from large fields of the same variety. And I thought that these types of beans rarely cross pollinate even if closely planted with other varieties. I think I would feel lucky if I got a bean to cross pollinate. Also, I have ordered all sorts of seeds from Gold Mine Natural Foods (all organic) and always get 80-100% germination. Sometimes if you are looking for something rare you have to take a chance that they will not germinate. Like the tomato seeds I got from 1935. None of them germinated! :.(
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 17, 2011 0:07:08 GMT -5
Thanks Happy Skunk,
The issue with the packages of beans is that they all look perfect in the bag, because the cross doesn't show until the next generation. IF the beans are crossed up, I've lost one year in the trial. Some places beans cross a lot, other places not so much so. The problem with the beans in the bag is I don't know who grew them, how they were grown. Italy is a wild place, much like California. There are deserts, mountains, and plains. In the desert and mountains beans can cross as much as 25%. We're talking few producers here. For example, there is only one known producer, registered of the bean known as Giallo. Maybe there's more of them. Maybe this farmer is the last one. I don't want these beans to disappear. I will go to extraordinary lengths to keep them going. (Unfortunately I didn't get the golden spoon that will let me go to Italy and seek out that farmer.) Most of the farms I have seen in Italy are 10-20 acres. The grapes have taken the rest and housing. My hope is that someone reading this will say, hey, he's my neighbor. And the beans will come to me. Hey, beans are magic. I can only import 50 beans. That's barely enough for genetic diversity! I will grow them out, send them to the lab for nutritional specs. Grow them again and then send them out to bean savers to keep them alive. What I'm trying to find is the farmer. I appreciate all your help and yes, if I can't find them any other way, I will get them from the store and spend a couple of years trying to work it out.
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 17, 2011 0:07:39 GMT -5
P.S. I like your hat
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 17, 2011 0:19:34 GMT -5
Hey Happyskunk, I saw your garden...more vege porn...oh so beautiful. Where are the weeds? I had intruders too. Amy Goldman sent me some watermelon seeds for my CSA. Day 120 peppers were picked in the commercial fields next door, across the creek. When I went out to pick, all the watermelons were gone... no shoes left to witness. Sigh.
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Post by happyskunk on Feb 17, 2011 1:28:08 GMT -5
Thanks Holly & Leo for the compliments on my hat and garden. I have quite a few Italian beans but sadly none from your list. I wish you the best in saving these bean varieties! I really like beans too but I'll let others preserve them. I'm more interested in growing and breeding beans that are well adapted to my climate. Eventually I hope to have my own landraces that I guess someone can try to save someday if they want. I do have one question though. Once you take these seeds from Italy and then grow them won't they end up being slightly different than they were before? Can they really be preserved? I ask think because I have been thinking about the potential affects of epigenetics on plant breeding lately. Can communities of organisms and the climate change plants over time? Check out this NOVA video on epigenetics video.pbs.org/video/1525107473/ |
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 17, 2011 22:56:54 GMT -5
Happy Skunk,
I believe that nature is forever changing. In William Woys Weaver's book on Heirloom Vege Gardening, he says that even the fava we think is the fava has drastically changed over the years. We can try to maintain a variety, but eventually they evolve. That's fine with me. What I'm trying to start with is a superior genetic material. Grow enough of it to get it out there. For example, a pinto is about 12% protein, some Baddas are almost twice this amount. If I'm going to try to save a bean, I want one that has the best nutrition, a low fart factor, great flavor, yields, disease resistance and weather be damned. Will it rain? Will it be dry? Last week I was wearing shorts, today it hailed...I know I can't keep it a Badda Bean from Italy forever. But maybe, I can link it to a corn, a squash and some mycelium and end up with something to wax poetic over with a glass of home brew and a grilled fish. Nothing lives forever. The only thing we can be sure of is change. Heck, I'm no longer thin, smart, or young. PM me your address and I'll send you your bouquet of sunflowers.
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Post by castanea on Feb 17, 2011 23:11:24 GMT -5
What is the history of the Badda beans? I have never heard of them.
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Post by happyskunk on Feb 18, 2011 4:35:15 GMT -5
mmmm beans, homebrew, and grilled fish sound good right now! I am also looking for a "best nutrition" bean and I am diabetic so the lower the glycemic index the better. This year I plan on growing Tepary beans. I guess they have 20-30% protein, lower glycemic index (40), higher in fiber, lower in compounds that make beans hards to digest, and they are higher in a wide array of other nutrients and fat. Also growing a small green chickpea. Channa Dal has a glycemic index of only 8!?! www.mendosa.com/chanadal.html |
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Post by 12540dumont on Feb 18, 2011 18:26:09 GMT -5
fxcuisine.com/default.asp?language=2&Display=225&resolution=highBadda Beans hailed from a small area in Sicily, specifically, the Polizzi Generosa Gardens of Madonie Park. They had been grown in the area for over two hundred years and were on the Slow Food Ark of Taste in Europe. Apparently, the bean has a color variation due to climate and soil variation. When they are ivory and yellow/orange they are known as Badda Bianco, but they can also be ivory and dark purple in which case they are known as Badda Nero. In Sicily they are used for Pasta e Fagioli, (a great soup recipe!) and they are also served with fresh tomatoes, in several seafood preparations, and in a simple bean soup with wild fennel and pork rind. I'm guessing that in different regions they grew and changed to become the 2 varieties. Badda refers to the ball shape of the bean. The first link talks about the biggest food fair in Europe. www.echonet.org/content/AtoZChap3/1366 A really good discussion of tepary beans. These guys do a great job reviewing the vegetables they grow. No doubt beans are good for diabetics. The beans with low Oligosaccharides make you fart less, but they also have less Prebiotic activity. Hard to win with this one. Plants with large amounts of oligosaccharides include chicory root, Jerusalem artichokes (I can't even digest these!). They are also found in onions (and the rest of the "onion family", including leeks and garlic), legumes, wheat, asparagus, and jicama. Garbanzo, Cece, Chickpea, it's all humus to me.
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Post by castanea on Mar 26, 2011 16:28:45 GMT -5
fxcuisine.com/default.asp?language=2&Display=225&resolution=highBadda Beans hailed from a small area in Sicily, specifically, the Polizzi Generosa Gardens of Madonie Park. They had been grown in the area for over two hundred years and were on the Slow Food Ark of Taste in Europe. Apparently, the bean has a color variation due to climate and soil variation. When they are ivory and yellow/orange they are known as Badda Bianco, but they can also be ivory and dark purple in which case they are known as Badda Nero. In Sicily they are used for Pasta e Fagioli, (a great soup recipe!) and they are also served with fresh tomatoes, in several seafood preparations, and in a simple bean soup with wild fennel and pork rind. I'm guessing that in different regions they grew and changed to become the 2 varieties. Badda refers to the ball shape of the bean. The first link talks about the biggest food fair in Europe. www.echonet.org/content/AtoZChap3/1366 A really good discussion of tepary beans. These guys do a great job reviewing the vegetables they grow. No doubt beans are good for diabetics. The beans with low Oligosaccharides make you fart less, but they also have less Prebiotic activity. Hard to win with this one. Plants with large amounts of oligosaccharides include chicory root, Jerusalem artichokes (I can't even digest these!). They are also found in onions (and the rest of the "onion family", including leeks and garlic), legumes, wheat, asparagus, and jicama. Garbanzo, Cece, Chickpea, it's all humus to me. Are you aware that there is a grower in California who has Badda beans? Tierra Vegetables |
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